Low Watt voted 1st team All Pro again

[ToddHaleysNineIron]

I don't know why you guys respond to the troll... guy demanding 4th qtr stats also probably will tell you Pickett's 4th qtr stats don't mean anything... the worst type of troll... a dumb one who moves goalposts constantly. Just put him on ignore, much easier.

Watt got less votes than Myles "1 sack in his last 5 games" Garrett which does not bode well for another DPOY win... it most likely will go to Garrett and his average season....

To me, that cheapens the award to the point now it's just one of those career acknowledgement type of awards. Garrett isn't anywhere near the top in some of the statistical categories with other guys outside of Watt outperforming him.

And PFF... my goodness what a joke that's become even moreso than before. Trying to justify these stats they make up, when we have actual stats like sacks, pressures, hits, TFL, etc to judge by.... for their sake they better hope Garrett doesn't win... because they are going to be seen as the main driver of this, and I'm going to think most people are going to look at the stats and say WTF at the end.

[Jobu]

I don't know why you guys respond to the troll... guy demanding 4th qtr stats also probably will tell you Pickett's 4th qtr stats don't mean anything... the worst type of troll... a dumb one who moves goalposts constantly. Just put him on ignore, much easier.

Watt got less votes than Myles "1 sack in his last 5 games" Garrett which does not bode well for another DPOY win... it most likely will go to Garrett and his average season....

To me, that cheapens the award to the point now it's just one of those career acknowledgement type of awards. Garrett isn't anywhere near the top in some of the statistical categories with other guys outside of Watt outperforming him.

And PFF... my goodness what a joke that's become even moreso than before. Trying to justify these stats they make up, when we have actual stats like sacks, pressures, hits, TFL, etc to judge by.... for their sake they better hope Garrett doesn't win... because they are going to be seen as the main driver of this, and I'm going to think most people are going to look at the stats and say WTF at the end.

Excellent post!

[zeke5123]

I don't know why you guys respond to the troll... guy demanding 4th qtr stats also probably will tell you Pickett's 4th qtr stats don't mean anything... the worst type of troll... a dumb one who moves goalposts constantly. Just put him on ignore, much easier.

Watt got less votes than Myles "1 sack in his last 5 games" Garrett which does not bode well for another DPOY win... it most likely will go to Garrett and his average season....

To me, that cheapens the award to the point now it's just one of those career acknowledgement type of awards. Garrett isn't anywhere near the top in some of the statistical categories with other guys outside of Watt outperforming him.

And PFF... my goodness what a joke that's become even moreso than before. Trying to justify these stats they make up, when we have actual stats like sacks, pressures, hits, TFL, etc to judge by.... for their sake they better hope Garrett doesn't win... because they are going to be seen as the main driver of this, and I'm going to think most people are going to look at the stats and say WTF at the end.

The concept behind PFF grades aren’t garbage. But people are desperate for advanced stats and seemingly cite PFF as if it is better than traditional stats despite no one proving that is the case (unlike in baseball where there is a lot of math supporting the advanced stats superiority).

Take the Watt v. Smollet discussion. So PFF says Smollet is double teamed far more often. Does that really make sense? Watt leads the league in sacks; has been leading the league in sacks pretty much every healthy season he has played. But we are to believe opposing coordinators don’t double team Watt? Maybe there is some error in PFF’s grading where chips / RB help aren’t accounted for?

Or pass rushing win rate v. sacks. I could be talked into beating a blocker more frequently generating more pressure is more valuable than less frequent pressure but more sacks. But no one has proven that out. How many extras pressures are worth one sack? Or how much is a pressure worth a pass defense via thr TJ swat? These things can be compared mathematically by finding correlation with defensive performance but has anyone done that? Maybe they have but I haven’t seen it brought up at all.

So we are asked to believe PFF is more accurate compared to traditional stats but they haven’t provided context for this belief.

[ToddHaleysNineIron]

If Im at PFF and I do all these things with pass rush win rate... and the stats are this lopsided to show that whatever it is I consider a "win" doesn't line up.... I re-evaluate what the hell I'm doing.

Instead they continue to push on... to me, most people are already looking at their stats as a joke, because it doesn't line up with what actually matters, Garrett winning the award is going to piss on the award and that will roll off on to PFF for promoting Garrett so much.

The double team thing I believe has been discussed... if what I've read about it is true, it's a pointless measurement... totally out of line with how offenses deal with edge rushers.

[Pabst]

Myles "1 sack in his last 5 games" Garrett

6 games, but who's counting

[Pabst]

The concept behind PFF grades aren’t garbage. But people are desperate for advanced stats and seemingly cite PFF as if it is better than traditional stats despite no one proving that is the case (unlike in baseball where there is a lot of math supporting the advanced stats superiority).

Take the Watt v. Smollet discussion. So PFF says Smollet is double teamed far more often. Does that really make sense? Watt leads the league in sacks; has been leading the league in sacks pretty much every healthy season he has played. But we are to believe opposing coordinators don’t double team Watt? Maybe there is some error in PFF’s grading where chips / RB help aren’t accounted for?

Or pass rushing win rate v. sacks. I could be talked into beating a blocker more frequently generating more pressure is more valuable than less frequent pressure but more sacks. But no one has proven that out. How many extras pressures are worth one sack? Or how much is a pressure worth a pass defense via thr TJ swat? These things can be compared mathematically by finding correlation with defensive performance but has anyone done that? Maybe they have but I haven’t seen it brought up at all.

So we are asked to believe PFF is more accurate compared to traditional stats but they haven’t provided context for this belief.

Even the baseball stats have their flaws (WAR badly overrates older players)

Regardless, great post. Advanced stats are a *supplement* to traditional stats, not a replacement. If Garrett's Win Rate is so high but his sack and TFL numbers are comparitively low that could suggest a number of things:
- He quits on plays where he doesn't get home
- His "wins" are predictable and teams can easily adjust
- The metric is flawed to begin with

Should also add - Pat McAfee had a great rant on PFF stats a while back. His biggest criticism was that PFF doesn't know someone's assignment on any given play

[SteelerDayTrader]

Myles "1 sack in his last 5 games" Garrett

6 games, but who's counting

Careful

Exactly the same as TJ

[Magnificent Mike]

Watt is hands down a better overall football player than Garrett.

Doesn't get the benefit of moving around and doesn't rush as much, yet puts up similar sack and pressure numbers. But he also drops into coverage, and while maybe not an elite coverage LBer he's above average.

I think it probably hurt Watt's case when it looked like he was playing on a bad team that wouldn't make the playoffs. You could argue Watt is every bit as valuable to the Steelers as a Mahomes or Allen, especially with how that offense ran with Canada/Pickett/Trubisky. And that makes Watt clearly the most valuable defensive player in the league, and it's not really close.

[Pabst]

Myles "1 sack in his last 5 games" Garrett

6 games, but who's counting

Careful

Exactly the same as TJ

What's exactly the same as TJ?

[Baltostiller]

Joins Rod Woodson and Jack Ham for most All-Pro selections in their first seven seasons in Steelers history.

Oops! Meant to say Fraud Woodson and Jackoff Ham. Fellow bums who nobody will remember.

You know, I was daydreaming about how cool it would be to replace Robin Cole from those mid to late 70's Steelers teams with Watt.

Ham was the greatest coverage linebacker I've ever seen. Lambert....wasn't human. He was an Animal. Greenwood and White scared the living shit out of tackles and Holmes and Joe Greene absolutely fucking destroyed offenses between the tackles.

Could you imagine Watt on those teams?

Teams might have fucking punted on first down.

I understand they played a 4-3 back then, but TJ can cover too. No fucking way you're stopping LC Greenwood and Watt on the same side when it comes to rushing the passer.

QB's seriously might have died.

A friend of mine played OT in the nfl for 7 years, won a national championship in college and told me that the hardest he was ever hit was by Robin Cole on an interception return. Cole was a badass, my friend is 6’6” and was 290 back then which was a big OT at the time.

[Baltostiller]

Watt is hands down a better overall football player than Garrett.

Doesn't get the benefit of moving around and doesn't rush as much, yet puts up similar sack and pressure numbers. But he also drops into coverage, and while maybe not an elite coverage LBer he's above average.

I think it probably hurt Watt's case when it looked like he was playing on a bad team that wouldn't make the playoffs. You could argue Watt is every bit as valuable to the Steelers as a Mahomes or Allen, especially with how that offense ran with Canada/Pickett/Trubisky. And that makes Watt clearly the most valuable defensive player in the league, and it's not really close.

Did Garrett even dress yesterday? I never heard his name called.

[K_C_]

Joins Rod Woodson and Jack Ham for most All-Pro selections in their first seven seasons in Steelers history.

Oops! Meant to say Fraud Woodson and Jackoff Ham. Fellow bums who nobody will remember.

You know, I was daydreaming about how cool it would be to replace Robin Cole from those mid to late 70's Steelers teams with Watt.

Ham was the greatest coverage linebacker I've ever seen. Lambert....wasn't human. He was an Animal. Greenwood and White scared the living shit out of tackles and Holmes and Joe Greene absolutely fucking destroyed offenses between the tackles.

Could you imagine Watt on those teams?

Teams might have fucking punted on first down.

I understand they played a 4-3 back then, but TJ can cover too. No fucking way you're stopping LC Greenwood and Watt on the same side when it comes to rushing the passer.

QB's seriously might have died.

A friend of mine played OT in the nfl for 7 years, won a national championship in college and told me that the hardest he was ever hit was by Robin Cole on an interception return. Cole was a badass, my friend is 6’6” and was 290 back then which was a big OT at the time.

Cole was one helluva player.

Watt is headed for the Hall of Fame.

I'm not slamming Robin Cole but Watt is an all time great. Steelers from that period said Watt would dominate in their time.

I believe them.

You have to remember, Watt has to pull up now. He can't drive QB's into the ground or land with his full body weight on a QB. Watt couldn't pile drive motherfuckers to the point they die on the field.

He could back then.

[stillthere]

I requested stats first

This is not about other players

It’s about the fact Watt has never come close to being a clutch performer

Good player. Sometimes great

Pretty much 0 - for career in the clutch

Why would you only want the Watt stats? Surely you want to compare him to other great pass rushers.

Nope


Not the point

OK. If the only numbers we can look at are from Trent Jordan Watt then that means he is the number 1 in every category and the best of all time in all said categories. I agree. Watt is the best that has ever played edge rusher in the NFL. Once you whittled down the qualifications it was really easy to see the answer.

[anpsteel]

You know, I was daydreaming about how cool it would be to replace Robin Cole from those mid to late 70's Steelers teams with Watt.

Ham was the greatest coverage linebacker I've ever seen. Lambert....wasn't human. He was an Animal. Greenwood and White scared the living shit out of tackles and Holmes and Joe Greene absolutely fucking destroyed offenses between the tackles.

Could you imagine Watt on those teams?

Teams might have fucking punted on first down.

I understand they played a 4-3 back then, but TJ can cover too. No fucking way you're stopping LC Greenwood and Watt on the same side when it comes to rushing the passer.

QB's seriously might have died.

A friend of mine played OT in the nfl for 7 years, won a national championship in college and told me that the hardest he was ever hit was by Robin Cole on an interception return. Cole was a badass, my friend is 6’6” and was 290 back then which was a big OT at the time.

Cole was one helluva player.

Watt is headed for the Hall of Fame.

I'm not slamming Robin Cole but Watt is an all time great. Steelers from that period said Watt would dominate in their time.

I believe them.

You have to remember, Watt has to pull up now. He can't drive QB's into the ground or land with his full body weight on a QB. Watt couldn't pile drive motherfuckers to the point they die on the field.

He could back then.

Imagine TJ being able to hit the way Lloyd hit?

Also Robin Cole was under rated, he just happened to be surrounded by players who’s skill and reputation made him a role player


He’s a Dirt Winston or Ron Johnson

Well maybe not Jonson lol

[SteelerDayTrader]

Why would you only want the Watt stats? Surely you want to compare him to other great pass rushers.

Nope


Not the point

OK. If the only numbers we can look at are from Trent Jordan Watt then that means he is the number 1 in every category and the best of all time in all said categories. I agree. Watt is the best that has ever played edge rusher in the NFL. Once you whittled down the qualifications it was really easy to see the answer.

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.3
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 2

[K_C_]

Nope


Not the point

OK. If the only numbers we can look at are from Trent Jordan Watt then that means he is the number 1 in every category and the best of all time in all said categories. I agree. Watt is the best that has ever played edge rusher in the NFL. Once you whittled down the qualifications it was really easy to see the answer.

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.3
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 2

What’s TJ’s postseason TD average?

Wasn’t he the only Steeler to score a point in the first half of their last playoff game?

Why was that?

[stillthere]

Nope


Not the point

OK. If the only numbers we can look at are from Trent Jordan Watt then that means he is the number 1 in every category and the best of all time in all said categories. I agree. Watt is the best that has ever played edge rusher in the NFL. Once you whittled down the qualifications it was really easy to see the answer.

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.3
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 2

Since these are the only numbers available to us we will have to determine that TJ Watt is #1 in both categories. It is pretty cool that he is on the Steelers n'at.

[SteelerDayTrader]

OK. If the only numbers we can look at are from Trent Jordan Watt then that means he is the number 1 in every category and the best of all time in all said categories. I agree. Watt is the best that has ever played edge rusher in the NFL. Once you whittled down the qualifications it was really easy to see the answer.

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.3
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 2

What’s TJ’s postseason TD average?

0.33


Of course that one TD occurred in a game where ol’ 0.3 Watt and the D gave up 42 points so…..

[K_C_]

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.3
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 2

What’s TJ’s postseason TD average?

0.33


Of course that one TD occurred in a game where ol’ 0.3 Watt and the D gave up 42 points so…..

How many points did Ben and the offense put up in the first half?

At the end of 4 quarters?

Bueller?

When did the offense get their first 1st down? Which quarter?

[stillthere]

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.3
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 2

What’s TJ’s postseason TD average?

0.33


Of course that one TD occurred in a game where ol’ 0.3 Watt and the D gave up 42 points so…..

So you are saying that TJ the Man Watt spotted the team 7 points and they couldn't help row the boat to victory? Man TJ is amazing just like you said he is the #1 in all the postseason stats that count.

[SteelerDayTrader]

Of course with TJ taking another one of his injury vacations now when it counts would mean we gotta adjust his “true” averages are right ? Lol

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.25
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 1.5

And yes I’ll include the TD he scored on the day he and the defense gave up a 40+ burger and lost the game lol

TJ Watt post season TD average = 0.25

[SteelerDayTrader]

Of course with TJ taking another one of his injury vacations now when it counts would mean we gotta adjust his “true” averages are right ? Lol

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.25
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 1.5

And yes I’ll include the TD he scored on the day he and the defense gave up a 40+ burger and lost the game lol

TJ Watt post season TD average = 0.25

Going to be tough for Highsmith Herbig and Golden to hit those heights I know………lol

[stillthere]

[Professor Half Wit]

Of course with TJ taking another one of his injury vacations now when it counts would mean we gotta adjust his “true” averages are right ? Lol

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.25
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 1.5

And yes I’ll include the TD he scored on the day he and the defense gave up a 40+ burger and lost the game lol

TJ Watt post season TD average = 0.25

Going to be tough for Highsmith Herbig and Golden to hit those heights I know………lol

Do you have a super genius theory for why the Steelers are 1–10 without The Great Disappearer—and very, very likely about to be 1–11? Or is the team’s record without Watt on the field also irrelevant?

[K_C_]

Of course with TJ taking another one of his injury vacations now when it counts would mean we gotta adjust his “true” averages are right ? Lol

TJ Watt post season sack average = 0.25
TJ Watt post season tackle average = 1.5

And yes I’ll include the TD he scored on the day he and the defense gave up a 40+ burger and lost the game lol

TJ Watt post season TD average = 0.25

Going to be tough for Highsmith Herbig and Golden to hit those heights I know………lol

Do you have a super genius theory for why the Steelers are 1–10 without The Great Disappearer—and very, very likely about to be 1–11? Or is the team’s record without Watt on the field also irrelevant?

Yep, in Ben's final year, the only reason we beat Buffalo in Buffalo was because TJ Watt wrecked that game and Josh Allen for 4 quarters.

Relentlessly pressured Allen and forced him into bad throws all day long.

https://www.nfl.com/videos/can-t-miss-p ... josh-allen

[Stosh-67]

Perfect...
Pretty much constant stat line for the last 7 weeks...
Never had more than 3 tackles in any of the last 11 games.... and ONE sack last 7 game...
15 tackles and 1 sack last 7 games.
THATS almost HALF A SEASON.

[Pabst]

Do you have a super genius theory for why the Steelers are 1–10 without The Great Disappearer—and very, very likely about to be 1–11? Or is the team’s record without Watt on the field also irrelevant?

[Stosh-67]

Let's bring some levity to this topic....right here, right now...

Old Man Cam.... last 7 games
2 sacks, 19 tackles, 3 TFL, 2 QBH, 1 pd

MG
1 sack, 15 tackles, 6 tfl, 7 qbh, 1 PD

Or Myles teammate..
Z. Smith
3 sacks 4 tfl 9 qbh

[955876]

Perfect...
Pretty much constant stat line for the last 7 weeks...
Never had more than 3 tackles in any of the last 11 games.... and ONE sack last 7 game...
15 tackles and 1 sack last 7 games.
THATS almost HALF A SEASON.

I had actually never noticed before that Myles "Jussie Smollet" Garrett wore #95. Not real pleased with that.

[the-other-burg]

Watt will be completely invisible today, just watch. I bet we dont here his name called once.