Hall of Famer Mike Tomlin

[SteelPro]

A point in Tomlin’s favor is the record in Ben’s absences is pretty good. 18-14. I certainly give him more credit than some here. Comparing him to Jason Garrett is nonsense. My biggest knock on Tomlin is I can’t point to any examples that his teams significantly over performed. Last season was probably the closest thing to a true over performance. For me the greatest coaches not only win championships and win games consistently in the regular season, but they also lead some kind of signature post season upsets.

Saying it's nonsense doesn't make it so.

I agree. It stands on its own. I didn’t have to say it to make it so. It just is.

[Havoc]

A point in Tomlin’s favor is the record in Ben’s absences is pretty good. 18-14. I certainly give him more credit than some here. Comparing him to Jason Garrett is nonsense. My biggest knock on Tomlin is I can’t point to any examples that his teams significantly over performed. Last season was probably the closest thing to a true over performance. For me the greatest coaches not only win championships and win games consistently in the regular season, but they also lead some kind of signature post season upsets.

Saying it's nonsense doesn't make it so.

I agree. It stands on its own. I didn’t have to say it to make it so. It just is.

So, you got nothin'

[SteelPro]

Saying it's nonsense doesn't make it so.

I agree. It stands on its own. I didn’t have to say it to make it so. It just is.

So, you got nothin'

You’ve not brought anything to this discussion other than an opinion. And I’ve stated mine. I think Tomlin is a good coach.. not one of the best ever, but certainly one of the better coaches over the past two decades. And I think it is laughable to compare him to Garrett. I’ve already refuted that Tomlin’s successes are all because of Big Ben. His record without Big Ben is a respectable 18-14. That is basically the same winning percentage as Garrett’s whole career. Let’s talk about a common complaint that Tomlin doesn’t adjust. From 2017-2019 the Steelers own the best record in the NFL when trailing at the half.

https://preview.redd.it/bmduo5cb22a41.p ... c611dd311e

Those stats look like a coach that knows how to fix things that aren’t working. Conversely Garrett has been horrible over that same stretch. I know Tomlin has his flaws. And yeah, conservatism bites him at times. He is still better than most coaches, and he is light years better than Jason Garrett.

[Jobu]

Tebow loss was epic

Blake Fuckin Bortles with our offense going nuts and Ben putting on an aerial show

Embarrassing

Was the Tebow Teabag on Tomlin or LeBeau?

Personally, I put the brunt of it on Lebeau. He just didn’t seem to understand the zone read offense. Lebeau defended everyone and everything pretty much the same...99% of the time , that was good enough.
Tebow had 10 completions for over 300 yards. Lebeau and his defense had no answer and no clue. The secondary was as confused as a 13 year old on his first date and James Harrison is still chasing shadows down that field. Sadly, right up until the final, game losing play, they were still defending the same way.
Not only is that, IMO, the worst loss in Tomlin’s career, probably one of the worst, most inexplicable losses in Steelers history. Right up there with the AFCCG home loss to the Chargers, and the Texans marching into Pittsburgh, putting up 40 some yards of offense and dancing back home with a W.

[gpclay]

I have terrible memories of the 2006 loss on the road when they were stumbling defending champs to the (eventually) 2-14 Raiders when Ben threw not one but two pick sixes. Or the two thrashings at the hands of the Ravens after they turned it around that year (27-0 and 31-7), causing them to miss the playoffs.

Also those two beat downs by the Browns and the Bengals to start 1989 0-2 and a combined 10-92 on the scoreboard. I still can’t recall how that team turned it around, and you could probably throw the heartbreak in Denver that season in the Divisional Round on the pile (at least the Broncos were a good team led by Elway so that win would have been an upset. But so close!!!)

[K_C_]

Yes, because we have the team that can do it now unlike previous years that you and others want to keep bringing up. We did have a "deep playoff run" as recently as 2016 with a team that was inferior to this one. Last time we had a team as good as this one, we went to a super bowl.

I sure hope you're right.

Been a LOOOOONG time since a Tomlin coached team looked playoff ready.

...and don't give me the horseshit about 2016. Tomlin needed an utter miracle to survive the great AJ McCarron and the Bungles.

[SteelPro]

Yes, because we have the team that can do it now unlike previous years that you and others want to keep bringing up. We did have a "deep playoff run" as recently as 2016 with a team that was inferior to this one. Last time we had a team as good as this one, we went to a super bowl.

I sure hope you're right.

Been a LOOOOONG time since a Tomlin coached team looked playoff ready.

...and don't give me the horseshit about 2016. Tomlin needed an utter miracle to survive the great AJ McCarron and the Bungles.

Wasn't the same season. 2016 season they destroyed the Dolphins in the Wild Card game and then beat KC on the road in the Divisional Round. Of course they got smoked by the Patriots in the AFC Championship.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... 6/gamelog/

[zeke5123]

I agree. It stands on its own. I didn’t have to say it to make it so. It just is.

So, you got nothin'

You’ve not brought anything to this discussion other than an opinion. And I’ve stated mine. I think Tomlin is a good coach.. not one of the best ever, but certainly one of the better coaches over the past two decades. And I think it is laughable to compare him to Garrett. I’ve already refuted that Tomlin’s successes are all because of Big Ben. His record without Big Ben is a respectable 18-14. That is basically the same winning percentage as Garrett’s whole career. Let’s talk about a common complaint that Tomlin doesn’t adjust. From 2017-2019 the Steelers own the best record in the NFL when trailing at the half.

https://preview.redd.it/bmduo5cb22a41.p ... c611dd311e

Those stats look like a coach that knows how to fix things that aren’t working. Conversely Garrett has been horrible over that same stretch. I know Tomlin has his flaws. And yeah, conservatism bites him at times. He is still better than most coaches, and he is light years better than Jason Garrett.

I’m not really convinced that is because of good adjustments as much as bone headed game plans. It has been common for the offense to struggle as we try to turn each set of downs into 3rd and 2. We fall behind and ask Ben to sling it around and we have success with that. The problem is why don’t we have Ben sling it around from the start?

[K_C_]

Yes, because we have the team that can do it now unlike previous years that you and others want to keep bringing up. We did have a "deep playoff run" as recently as 2016 with a team that was inferior to this one. Last time we had a team as good as this one, we went to a super bowl.

I sure hope you're right.

Been a LOOOOONG time since a Tomlin coached team looked playoff ready.

...and don't give me the horseshit about 2016. Tomlin needed an utter miracle to survive the great AJ McCarron and the Bungles.

Wasn't the same season. 2016 season they destroyed the Dolphins in the Wild Card game and then beat KC on the road in the Divisional Round. Of course they got smoked by the Patriots in the AFC Championship.

https://www.pro-football-reference.com/ ... 6/gamelog/

Ah, good call. I stand corrected.

[SteelPro]

So, you got nothin'

You’ve not brought anything to this discussion other than an opinion. And I’ve stated mine. I think Tomlin is a good coach.. not one of the best ever, but certainly one of the better coaches over the past two decades. And I think it is laughable to compare him to Garrett. I’ve already refuted that Tomlin’s successes are all because of Big Ben. His record without Big Ben is a respectable 18-14. That is basically the same winning percentage as Garrett’s whole career. Let’s talk about a common complaint that Tomlin doesn’t adjust. From 2017-2019 the Steelers own the best record in the NFL when trailing at the half.

https://preview.redd.it/bmduo5cb22a41.p ... c611dd311e

Those stats look like a coach that knows how to fix things that aren’t working. Conversely Garrett has been horrible over that same stretch. I know Tomlin has his flaws. And yeah, conservatism bites him at times. He is still better than most coaches, and he is light years better than Jason Garrett.

I’m not really convinced that is because of good adjustments as much as bone headed game plans. It has been common for the offense to struggle as we try to turn each set of downs into 3rd and 2. We fall behind and ask Ben to sling it around and we have success with that. The problem is why don’t we have Ben sling it around from the start?

Maybe. But those numbers don't back it up. Over that three year span that I posted only 5 teams trailed at the half fewer times than the Steelers. So are we really falling behind that often? And 3 of the 8 victories when trailing at the half were in 2019 when Big Ben was injured.

[Havoc]

Tebow loss was epic

Blake Fuckin Bortles with our offense going nuts and Ben putting on an aerial show

Embarrassing

Was the Tebow Teabag on Tomlin or LeBeau?

Lebeau (potted plant era)

[Havoc]

I agree. It stands on its own. I didn’t have to say it to make it so. It just is.

So, you got nothin'

You’ve not brought anything to this discussion other than an opinion. And I’ve stated mine. I think Tomlin is a good coach.. not one of the best ever, but certainly one of the better coaches over the past two decades. And I think it is laughable to compare him to Garrett. I’ve already refuted that Tomlin’s successes are all because of Big Ben. His record without Big Ben is a respectable 18-14. That is basically the same winning percentage as Garrett’s whole career. Let’s talk about a common complaint that Tomlin doesn’t adjust. From 2017-2019 the Steelers own the best record in the NFL when trailing at the half.

https://preview.redd.it/bmduo5cb22a41.p ... c611dd311e

Those stats look like a coach that knows how to fix things that aren’t working. Conversely Garrett has been horrible over that same stretch. I know Tomlin has his flaws. And yeah, conservatism bites him at times. He is still better than most coaches, and he is light years better than Jason Garrett.

Garrett took NFL snaps at QB for a dynasty.

Giants who recently took a RB with the #2 overall pick quickly signed Garrett at OC where again his conservative football philosophy will fit right in with that organization.

Jason Garrett never had a losing season at HC sans one 4-12 season with Cassell at QB and a defense 16th in points.... exactly where we were headed last year (worse actually) until Colbert and Minkah changed our season.

Garrett defense Pts rankings, 31, 16, 24, 26, 15, 16, 5, 13, 6, 11. Look who was buying him the groceries. That's what he had to work with. He also had 4 seasons with 4 different QBs.

8-8 is the enemy of greatness. Losing big is how we got Bradshaw, Greene, Ben.

Last season Tomlin clung to that defense for dear life as he always does. That team was not going to win the Lombardi. With the D playing at that level and what we were throwing out at QB.... that's the time to pull out all the stops, pull out all the gadgetry. Take lots of chances. You have nothing to lose.

Jimmy Johnson, smart man. Fleeced the Vikings, traded a premier RB who he could have kept. Tomlin would have clung to the premier RB for all his conservative life.

My position is not that Tomlin is a bad coach. My position is his conservative football philosophy is a bad fit in a league begging for offense and a worse fit when the strength of his rosters were by far the vertical passing game.

It should not take a once in 10 year defense to get a Lombardi but that is what it takes if you are going to strategize the offense under a conservative philosophy umbrella.

Jerry Jones really really liked Jason Garrett. All accounts locally here are Jerry agonized over the decision because he did not want to fire him.

Some locals here called Garrett the clapper, same sentiment many have said of Tomlin.

I do not see different results for our franchise if the nice guy conservative football philosophy Garrett were our next HC after Cowher instead of Tomlin.

[SteelerDayTrader]

Lololololz......this thread......lolololz

The same guys who are always ready to blow up the entire team after 2 or 3 losses in row

The same guys who think the season is over in every game thread when we are down 4+

The same guys who think Ben sucks when he throws an INT or 3

Lolololz

I could go on and on and on.....Lolz

[drmalba]

The "Mike Tomlin == Jason Garrett" idea makes me think of the deuce I dropped this morning.
- Smoothly presented
- A quick and painless process to create
- minimal paperwork
- Worthy of a few seconds' admiration, prior to flushing it down the toilet

[stillthere]

I will say that for those of you with a preference for John Harbaugh. I could not cheer for a team he coaches. Him and "The Michigan Man" are the two whiniest pussies in football today. I would hate to see a crybaby on the sidelines in Black and Gold attempting to lead my football team.

[El Kabong]

Harbaughs constantly work the refs which does get old to watch.

[Jobu]

It’s always fun watching the Harbaugh’s lose.
And no...I do not want either of them coaching the Steelers. Not that it would ever happen.

Harbaughs constantly work the refs which does get old to watch.

And his team follows his lead. A bunch of whiney assholes.

[stillthere]

It’s always fun watching the Harbaugh’s lose.
And no...I do not want either of them coaching the Steelers. Not that it would ever happen.

Harbaughs constantly work the refs which does get old to watch.

And his team follows his lead. A bunch of whiney assholes.

Precisely.

[Stillerz Bar]

It’s always fun watching the Harbaugh’s lose.
And no...I do not want either of them coaching the Steelers. Not that it would ever happen.

Harbaughs constantly work the refs which does get old to watch.

And his team follows his lead. A bunch of whiney assholes.

Absolutely. Seems like every time they drop a pass they look to the refs with their arms outstretched and that incredulous look on their face as if to say "There's no way I don't catch that unless I was interfered with. "

It gets so old watching them bitch. If they put as much effort into the game as they do whining they'd be even more dangerous. Fortunately for us they waste their energy.

[Kodiak]

take your pick

K C

havoc

stillthere

Kodiak

B2B - what's it going to take to perma-ban this loser?

[Kodiak]

You are either NIEVE or stupid

[K_C_]

I'm surprised this is so hard.

Tomlin inherited a future Hall of Fame QB. Dude was on his way when Tomlin arrived.

He coaches for the best organization in the NFL. He has lackluster seasons, is 1 and done in the playoffs losing to guys like Blake Bortles and Tim Tebow (along with needing a miracle against the great AJ McCarron) and no biggie. Job is never in jeopardy.

When Mikey T had a bunch of Cowher's players, he won big. Since they slowly left and retired....not so fucking much.

Baltostiller's comment that I'm using as my signature sums Tomlin up perfectly (except, Tomlin often struggles to motivate his Steelers against bottom feeders, which is beyond weird).

You say the Rooneys are the best organization in football

You say the rooneys are fucking idiots for having tomlin as coach

make up your FUCKING mind

Seriously, is paint huffing or meth your biggest issue?

[K_C_]

stop being nieve.

Why bring Elvis Costello and the Attractions into this?

[Jobu]

You are either NIEVE or stupid

[zeke5123]

I think we all want Mike T to be successful. No one here cares about the color of his skin. We do care about games when we are outcoached badly like last Sunday. It's not fun to trot out that miserable offense with the same telegraphed plays over and over. It's not pretty to watch our defense stay in base so much that our LBs are forced to cover WRs over and over again.

The last two weeks our HOF QB has had to play sandlot football to win games. Yes, I'm thrilled to be 8-0 but that is an indictment on our offensive game plan, play calling, and preparation. You can blame Rustbelt Randy, but the HC is accountable at the end of the day.

We've watched this all too often. Just ask yourself this. How often in the last 10 years have you come away from a big game thinking "Man, we were undermanned but our coaching was so superior that it won us the game" ?

At the end of the day, Mike Tomlin loves to impose his will. He thinks his best will beat your best. Quite often that is the case. But, in the playoffs and in key situations, it often isn't. The difference between winning and losing in big games is coaching. It's being innovative, surprising the other team, attacking THEIR WEAKNESSES while MAXIMIZING YOUR OWN STRENGTHS. It's putting your pride and your football philosophy into the garbage and doing whatever it takes to win.

I still don't see that from Tomlin, and I need to see in in the post season before he is coronated in my book.

You are either NIEVE or stupid. I will lean toward nieve. A SHIT TON of Steeler fans HATE Mike Tomlin right now and blame lack of success due to his being a black man.

take your pick

K C

havoc

stillthere

Kodiak


all four of these individuals are racist against black people to one extent or other....or extreme extent....

the ONLY reason they hate Tomlin is his skin color. One of them is HHH which if you google him is the lowest piece of steeler forum scum on the planet.

and one of them has his name derived from KILL COWHER which is not of course racist but is absolutely anti Steeler in every way.

these four low life blowhard losers DEFINE either racist or anti steeler

stop being nieve.

the real world has douches show up to attack anything steeler and anything black

Just a logic exercise here asshole:

Poster has a name based on kill Cowher.

Bill Cowher was a highly successful HOF coach.

Bill Cowher was white.

Mike Tomlin likely will be a HOF coach.

Is it likely that KC hates Tomlin because he is black or like most fans hates the coach of his team because of coach fuck ups?

[jewelsongs]

From the FF Peter King this morning


Tomlin The Beacon

Ten lessons Mike Tomlin can teach the NFL about fixing the head-coach hiring process, which includes increasing the inclusiveness for people of color:

1. Survey the entire field, not just the candidates you know. When 34-year-old Tomlin walked into the Steelers offices in Pittsburgh in January 2007, he shook hands with club czars Dan Rooney and Art Rooney II for the first time. They’d never met. The leading candidates for the job, Ken Whisenhunt and Russ Grimm, were on the Steeler staff; the Steelers had already satisfied the Rooney Rule—mandating at least one minority be interviewed for every head-coach opening—by interviewing Ron Rivera, of Hispanic descent. “He came in cold,” Art Rooney, son of Dan, told me about Tomlin last week. “[GM] Kevin Colbert put him on the list for us to look at.”

2. Open your eyes. After the first meeting with Tomlin, who’d just finished his rookie year as a coordinator (in Minnesota), Dan Rooney looked at Art and said: “He’s a real candidate.” The Rooneys had high regard for Whisenhunt and Grimm, but there was something commanding about Tomlin, though he was so young. That hadn’t bugged the Rooney family when they’d hired the unknown Chuck Noll at 37, or the better-known Bill Cowher at 34. They wanted to be careful to not be insular, a great lesson for teams today.

3. Listen to the people you truly trust. It’s possible that of anyone in the football business the Rooneys would trust about Tomlin, Tony Dungy was at the top of the list. Dungy had played for Chuck Noll, coached under Noll, and was tight with the Rooneys—and Dungy had hired Tomlin as his secondary coach in Tampa in 2001. The week the Steelers interviewed Tomlin, Dungy was preparing to coach the Colts in a divisional playoff game against higher-seeded Baltimore. Dan Rooney called him, mindful of his schedule but needing his counsel. “Dan told me, ‘He’s really impressed us. Tell me about him,’ “ Dungy recalled. “There was a twinkle in his voice. I could tell even though he’d just met Mike, he was intrigued.”

Dungy shared with Dan Rooney that Tomlin would be a great match for the Steeler ethos. “He had the Steeler philosophy. We’re going to do it our way, and not worry about anyone else. He was young, he was tough, and he was a great communicator with young players,” Dungy said. Art Rooney told me that without a strong recommendation from someone he and his father knew well and trusted, they might not have hired Tomlin.

4. Don’t care about winning the press conference. The Rooneys didn’t care in 1969 when they were openly questioned for hiring Noll, a little-known assistant for the Colts. They didn’t care when locals thought Grimm should have been the call in 2007, and the choice of Tomlin would unintentionally shake up the coaching staff. “We hired Mike because he was the best candidate for the job,” Art Rooney said, “and really, nothing else mattered.”

5. Hire a coach who is a leader of people, and a good teacher. So often, the top-candidate lists for head-coaching jobs are lists of the best coordinators in the NFL. It’s good, of course, to find coaches who are great on one side of the ball, or to hire coaches from a great tree. But Tomlin wasn’t hired because he worked under Dungy for one season, or because in his lone season as a coordinator he bossed the 14th-best scoring defense in the NFL. It was his presence, his knowledge of the game, and his ability to coach and deal with the modern player. That goes, too, for the coaches on the staff. Though he was a coordinator in Minnesota, Tomlin gave the defense to incumbent defensive coordinator Dick LeBeau when he arrived. LeBeau’s defenses were second and first in scoring defense in the league in 2007 and ’08.
Steelers coach Mike Tomlin. (Getty Images)

6. Hire a coach who is comfortable dishing out discipline. When Antonio Brown live-streamed Tomlin’s post-game talk to his team after a playoff win in January 2017, Tomlin called it “foolish, selfish and inconsiderate. We will punish him.” Part of the job. Tomlin didn’t shy away from confrontation. “A good coach has to be good at confrontation,” Bill Parcells says, and if you were around the Giants in the eighties (I was), you saw it often, and sometimes on national TV.

7. Hire a coach who can build an unbreakable bond with the players. In a playoff game in the 2010 season, Pittsburgh trailed Baltimore at halftime 21-7. All week, Tomlin told his team it would face some adversity. At halftime, he told his players they were built for this, they trained for this. On the way back to the field for the second half, he put an arm around safety Ryan Clark’s shoulders and said, “Wait till they see this comeback! The stories you guys will have—you’ll never forget this day!” Clark played the half of his life, forcing a fumble that led to a TD; Baltimore, 21-14. He intercepted Joe Flacco, leading to another TD; Tie, 21-21. Steelers won, 31-24. “If coach T doesn’t talk to me like that,” Clark told me last week, “I don’t think that happens. I honestly don’t think it happens. He had that effect on us.”

8. Hire a coach who’s okay with throwing players overboard. When Le’Veon Bell’s contract demands weren’t met after the 2017 season, he sat out the ’18 season and Tomlin didn’t seem too bothered by it. When Antonio Brown went AWOL before the final game of 2018, Tomlin told his agent he didn’t want Brown back for the game, and Brown never played for the Steelers again; Tomlin was okay with that too. Since Bell played his last game for the Steelers, Pittsburgh is 26-14-1. Since Brown went AWOL, Pittsburgh is 18-8. And keep in mind that 14 of those games for both players were played without Ben Roethlisberger. Bell and Brown would have been headaches if they’d stayed—so just move on. The Steelers now have very good and fairly ego-less receiver and running back groups, and, at midseason, are sixth in the league in scoring with Bell and Brown long gone.

9. Hire a coach who doesn’t care how famous he is. Ryan Clark told me he wondered why Tomlin didn’t share more with the press, “why he didn’t expound on decisions he made or why he game-planned a certain way or why he didn’t share how he good of a motivator he is.” So he asked Tomlin once. “He told me, ‘Those things are personal. I want you guys to get a glimpse of me, but I don’t need to share my soul with the rest of the world,’ “ Clark said. “I respected that. The players respected that. It made me feel like what we did in the building and the locker room and the stadium was sacred to him.” It’s reminiscent of Noll.

10. Have a good quarterback in-house. It helps to take over a team with a 25-year-old franchise quarterback just entering his prime. Writing the Tomlin story in Pittsburgh without mentioning Ben Roethlisberger’s importance to winning would be naïve. As with Belichick/Brady in New England, a coach looks a lot better when he’s got a Hall of Fame quarterback playing for him.

[Stosh-67]

Thanks for sharing that Jewel.
Good stuff.

[Stosh-67]

Minka.
Stop being antagonistic and Racist.
There is no tolerance for it.
Bye. Bye.

[stillthere]

You are either NIEVE or stupid. I will lean toward nieve. A SHIT TON of Steeler fans HATE Mike Tomlin right now and blame lack of success due to his being a black man.

take your pick

K C

havoc

stillthere

Kodiak


all four of these individuals are racist against black people to one extent or other....or extreme extent....

Let me say this slowly F-U-C-K Y-O-U asshole. You know fuck all about me.

[Professor Half Wit]

Isn't Nieve an aspirational bourgeoisie face soap?