Why Will Ben Be Successful in the 2020 Campaign?

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LakecrestSteeler
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Why Will Ben Be Successful in the 2020 Campaign?

Post by LakecrestSteeler » Sat Feb 08, 2020 10:15 pm

Why will the 38 year old, on March 2nd, have a successful 2020 campaign for the Steelers?

We seem to have a solid defense. Check.

Special teams returned to form. Check.

Running game was awful.

Receivers showed signs, but were generally underwhelming and inconsistent. The receiver with the best season just posted a picture in a hospital bed and the caption Ima bounce back.

TEs were amazingly vanilla as well, and unreliable.

The line has a big question mark.

Many of the offensive problems above can be cured by 7, but will they be?

Given the cap space if you were the owner and someone put a gun to your head, could you do better than Roethlisberger for a SuperBowl run?

Will Ben come back ala MJ, Smoltz and Tiger, although different circumstances and ages? Or will he be like our TB12 and fade into the HOF waiting period?

One HOF QB not named Bradshaw who is still a Steeler fan thinks Ben can have success in a story I missed:
https://www.usatoday.com/story/sports/n ... 2383686001

So much of the post injury success is probably determined by some luck, good circumstances, and supreme talent.

I think Ben is walking into some decent circumstances and he has supreme talent.

Will the circumstances allow for him to get his groove back, or will he have to put it on his shoulders too early to possibly denying us a successful 2020 campaign?

Ben wears lucky number 7....I optimistically hope his supreme talent, decent circumstances and penchant for luck push us through for a title.



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El Kabong
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Post by El Kabong » Sat Feb 08, 2020 11:54 pm

We're not going to know until Ben takes the field, but IF Ben is successful this year, it will be because his elbow is actually better than it has been the past few years due to the surgery, and as you say, he'll have a strong defense backing him up.

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Post by truckstoppornpatron » Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:47 am

With his repaired ligaments, he should have an increased elbow circumference. This coupled with the lack of slop in the joint should result in a more predictable delivery. Hopefully the strength gets to where it needs to be before Sept.

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Post by Rod & Wire Mill » Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:39 pm

El Kabong wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 11:54 pm
We're not going to know until Ben takes the field, but IF Ben is successful this year, it will be because his elbow is actually better than it has been the past few years due to the surgery, and as you say, he'll have a strong defense backing him up.
The injury was like a light bulb coming on for me. Explains a lot about his inconsistency in recent years, and even some of the Bell/ab antics to get out of town. I have hope, and willing to opine he’ll surprise on the upside. Anyone remember: “I’ve got a feeling...”?

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Post by Kodiak » Sun Feb 09, 2020 1:04 pm

Rod & Wire Mill wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:39 pm
The injury was like a light bulb coming on for me. Explains a lot about his inconsistency in recent years, and even some of the Bell/ab antics to get out of town. I have hope, and willing to opine he’ll surprise on the upside. Anyone remember: “I’ve got a feeling...”?
The arm issues may have contributed somewhat. But I think what this season showed more than anything is Ben's "turnovers" the past few years were simply a QB that had to take risks to make the offense work.

A QB trying to do too much rarely works out. Only real quibble I have, though, is the arm issues might explain why Ben used an extended preseason to try to play his way into shape.
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Post by LakecrestSteeler » Sun Feb 09, 2020 8:28 pm

Rod & Wire Mill wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 12:39 pm
El Kabong wrote:
Sat Feb 08, 2020 11:54 pm
We're not going to know until Ben takes the field, but IF Ben is successful this year, it will be because his elbow is actually better than it has been the past few years due to the surgery, and as you say, he'll have a strong defense backing him up.
The injury was like a light bulb coming on for me. Explains a lot about his inconsistency in recent years, and even some of the Bell/ab antics to get out of town. I have hope, and willing to opine he’ll surprise on the upside. Anyone remember: “I’ve got a feeling...”?
By what measure has he been inconsistent? His interceptions in 18 lead the league. More of an outlier in my opinion due to leading the league in yardage. Go through is stats and ge looks remarkably consistent. I don’t think Ben would honestly admit to an elbow issue outside of maybe is his last two games.

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Post by Rod & Wire Mill » Mon Feb 10, 2020 4:56 pm

I’m not at all into the granular on stats. (Not that there’s anything wrong with that) I remember a couple four years ago there was talk his production was down early in the season. I did a quick calculation and his yards per game was at exactly his career average.

I’m referring to game to game, sometimes within game stretches, where he’d go from phenomenal to abysmal accuracy. I was often baffled how he could be so good and so bad in so short an interval. Just an impression, opinion, on my part, but a nagging long term arm problem would explain it for me.

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Post by StillerDownSouth » Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:52 pm

I would be shocked if he looks anything like his old self, not just because of the surgery, but the dude is 38 and a year removed from playing competitive football. If I were running the Steelers, I would cut him loose, tell him thanks and roll with Duck/Mason next year in hopes of getting the number 1 pick the following year.

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Post by LakecrestSteeler » Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 pm

StillerDownSouth wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:52 pm
I would be shocked if he looks anything like his old self, not just because of the surgery, but the dude is 38 and a year removed from playing competitive football. If I were running the Steelers, I would cut him loose, tell him thanks and roll with Duck/Mason next year in hopes of getting the number 1 pick the following year.
I’d rather see Ben go down like King Kong on the Empire State or World Trade center, depending on which movie, then watch Duck and/or Mason.

I’d rather watch wildcat all year than Mason and/or Duck.

I’d rather root for the Browns than watch Mason and/or Duck.

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Post by StillerDownSouth » Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:00 pm

LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 pm
StillerDownSouth wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:52 pm
I would be shocked if he looks anything like his old self, not just because of the surgery, but the dude is 38 and a year removed from playing competitive football. If I were running the Steelers, I would cut him loose, tell him thanks and roll with Duck/Mason next year in hopes of getting the number 1 pick the following year.
I’d rather see Ben go down like King Kong on the Empire State or World Trade center, depending on which movie, then watch Duck and/or Mason.

I’d rather watch wildcat all year than Mason and/or Duck.

I’d rather root for the Browns than watch Mason and/or Duck.
Oh me too, but the PS are in a tough spot holding onto hope that Ben still has his fastball when it’ll probably be training camp at the the earliest when he can let it rip.

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Post by El Kabong » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:27 am

StillerDownSouth wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:00 pm
LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 pm
StillerDownSouth wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:52 pm
I would be shocked if he looks anything like his old self, not just because of the surgery, but the dude is 38 and a year removed from playing competitive football. If I were running the Steelers, I would cut him loose, tell him thanks and roll with Duck/Mason next year in hopes of getting the number 1 pick the following year.
I’d rather see Ben go down like King Kong on the Empire State or World Trade center, depending on which movie, then watch Duck and/or Mason.

I’d rather watch wildcat all year than Mason and/or Duck.

I’d rather root for the Browns than watch Mason and/or Duck.
Oh me too, but the PS are in a tough spot holding onto hope that Ben still has his fastball when it’ll probably be training camp at the the earliest when he can let it rip.
But you have to find out. You can't just cut Ben without knowing what his arm looks like.

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Post by LakecrestSteeler » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:28 am

They are only in a tough spot because they chose to be in a tough spot.

Just rewind Terry’s last year with the Steelers and plan accordingly. That is worst case scenario. They should probably plan to not have him for 1/3 of the season would be planful thinking.

Planning accordingly BTW is not Duck and Mason.

Sign a big name free agent backup and cut ties with MR and Duck. I’d put Lynch at number 2 before Mr and Duck.

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Post by Donnie Brasco » Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:53 pm

LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 9:32 pm
StillerDownSouth wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 6:52 pm
I would be shocked if he looks anything like his old self, not just because of the surgery, but the dude is 38 and a year removed from playing competitive football. If I were running the Steelers, I would cut him loose, tell him thanks and roll with Duck/Mason next year in hopes of getting the number 1 pick the following year.
I’d rather see Ben go down like King Kong on the Empire State or World Trade center, depending on which movie, then watch Duck and/or Mason.

I’d rather watch wildcat all year than Mason and/or Duck.

I’d rather root for the Browns than watch Mason and/or Duck.
This

Last year was an abomination on offense

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Post by Kodiak » Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:50 pm

Yeah, talk about bedwetting.....Prior to last season, Ben had missed ONE game in three years.

Brady and Brees playing at a high level into their 40's. Favre at 40 - 33 TD's against 7 picks. Really no reason to think Ben doesn't have a good two years left, maybe more. The problem with comparisons to Bradshaw - that was almost 30 years ago (the procedures have gotten just a little bit better), Bradshaw didn't tell anyone and rushed himself back.

The prognosis for Ben is 100% recovery, and probably a stronger arm than he's had for several years. It's not a 50/50 or even 20/80 proposition - it is, by far, the most likely outcome.
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Post by 955876 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:07 pm

The experience received last year plus working with a dedicated QB coach should hopefully elevate Rudolph’s game. I expect him to play with more confidence next year if called upon. Don’t really see him as the heir to Ben but I think he can be an ok back-up for time being.

Lynch needs to win either the #1 or #2 back-up job. Ideally number one given his physical tools.

Duck was abysmal and needs to get on with his life’s work. He simply doesn’t have NFL caliber physical tools.

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Post by bradshaw2ben » Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:26 pm

955876 wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:07 pm
The experience received last year plus working with a dedicated QB coach should hopefully elevate Rudolph’s game. I expect him to play with more confidence next year if called upon. Don’t really see him as the heir to Ben but I think he can be an ok back-up for time being.

Lynch needs to win either the #1 or #2 back-up job. Ideally number one given his physical tools.

Duck was abysmal and needs to get on with his life’s work. He simply doesn’t have NFL caliber physical tools.
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Post by Professor Half Wit » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:06 pm

LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:28 am
They are only in a tough spot because they chose to be in a tough spot.

Just rewind Terry’s last year with the Steelers and plan accordingly. That is worst case scenario. They should probably plan to not have him for 1/3 of the season would be planful thinking.

Planning accordingly BTW is not Duck and Mason.

Sign a big name free agent backup and cut ties with MR and Duck. I’d put Lynch at number 2 before Mr and Duck.
Big name FAs cost money the Steelers will not have. You want to let Bud go for a back up QB? Pass.
"Just don't kill us."

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Post by 955876 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:10 pm

Rudolph has a higher ceiling IMO than does Hodges. Neither will be capable of taking over full-time for Ben.

Real crime was going into last season with two green ass QBs and no dedicated coach for them.

But that’s how we like to roll.

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Post by LakecrestSteeler » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:32 pm

Kodiak wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:50 pm
Yeah, talk about bedwetting.....Prior to last season, Ben had missed ONE game in three years.

Brady and Brees playing at a high level into their 40's. Favre at 40 - 33 TD's against 7 picks. Really no reason to think Ben doesn't have a good two years left, maybe more. The problem with comparisons to Bradshaw - that was almost 30 years ago (the procedures have gotten just a little bit better), Bradshaw didn't tell anyone and rushed himself back.

The prognosis for Ben is 100% recovery, and probably a stronger arm than he's had for several years. It's not a 50/50 or even 20/80 proposition - it is, by far, the most likely outcome.
I don’t think using Bradshaw as a roadmap for planful thinking is bedwetting. I think it is planful thinking.

I agree with everything your saying though. I don’t think there will be problems, but I’d err on the side that he will miss a 1/3 of the season. When he starts throwing 75 yard bombs because he has a new rip cord in his elbow, that is when the rotator cuff goes. It could happen.

And if abortion football shows up when he is out, someone’s head should be on the platter. It shouldn’t take much to come up with a QB that can manage the offense for 5 games and look like Flacco or Foles at 80%.

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Post by tbsteel » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:53 pm

Going into next season with Daniel Carver and Duck Hodges as our backups is completely reckless, and will very likely fuck us at some point next season. Just like it fucked us out of the playoffs this year.

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Post by 955876 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 10:00 pm

Ya but ah schucks Rooney will just give his poor coach a patt on the back for having to deal with such adversity.

Kind of like 2017 when he said we’d be a playoff team if Boswell doesn’t slip trying to make the kick out in Oakland.

As if that was the biggest issue that day.

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Post by truckstoppornpatron » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:06 am

955876 wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:10 pm
Rudolph has a higher ceiling IMO than does Hodges. Neither will be capable of taking over full-time for Ben.

Real crime was going into last season with two green ass QBs and no dedicated coach for them.

But that’s how we like to roll.
Rudolph no doubt has a WAAAAAAAYYYY higher ceiling. They're not even comparable. We should have kept Landry Jones for a couple more years to hedge our bets

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Post by Kodiak » Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:52 am

truckstoppornpatron wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:06 am
Rudolph no doubt has a WAAAAAAAYYYY higher ceiling.
His ceiling is the floor for most draft picks. Saying Rudolph has a way higher ceiling is kind of like saying a heart attack is better than cancer.
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Post by Professor Half Wit » Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:07 pm

tbsteel wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:53 pm
Going into next season with Daniel Carver and Duck Hodges as our backups is completely reckless, and will very likely fuck us at some point next season. Just like it fucked us out of the playoffs this year.
Meant to comment on this.

It might be reckless, but given their cap and given their retention priorities, they are not going to be able to sign anyone better. What crucial piece do you expect them to cut to upgrade the back up quality?
"Just don't kill us."

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Post by 955876 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:43 pm

Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:52 am
truckstoppornpatron wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:06 am
Rudolph no doubt has a WAAAAAAAYYYY higher ceiling.
His ceiling is the floor for most draft picks. Saying Rudolph has a way higher ceiling is kind of like saying a heart attack is better than cancer.
If true, then we certainly can’t trust the current staff/front office to pick our next QB given the “1st round grade” they supposedly had on Mason.

Imagine them burning a first on such a maringally talented QB.

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Post by 955876 » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:44 pm

955876 wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:43 pm
Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 5:52 am
truckstoppornpatron wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:06 am
Rudolph no doubt has a WAAAAAAAYYYY higher ceiling.
His ceiling is the floor for most draft picks. Saying Rudolph has a way higher ceiling is kind of like saying a heart attack is better than cancer.
If true, then we certainly can’t trust the current staff/front office to pick the QB that will ultimately replace Ben given the “1st round grade” they supposedly had on Mason.

Imagine them burning a first on such a maringally talented QB.

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Post by LakecrestSteeler » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:53 pm

Professor Half Wit wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:07 pm
tbsteel wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:53 pm
Going into next season with Daniel Carver and Duck Hodges as our backups is completely reckless, and will very likely fuck us at some point next season. Just like it fucked us out of the playoffs this year.
Meant to comment on this.

It might be reckless, but given their cap and given their retention priorities, they are not going to be able to sign anyone better. What crucial piece do you expect them to cut to upgrade the back up quality?
Couldn’t you just do a 2 year guaranteed deal for $1 the first year and then $25,000,000 the second year or whatever the going rate is for a quality back-up is over 2 years.

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Post by LakecrestSteeler » Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:55 pm

From the Tribune Review, quoting Twitter...the best way to create a story:

_____________
In Wednesday’s “First Call,” someone is calling for Ben Roethlisberger’s retirement. Alex Galchenyuk made his Minnesota Wild debut. A frightening NHL event. Michigan State may have its coach. “Monday Night Football” games may get flexed.

You might be a little early on this

Former NFL player-turned-NFL analyst Chris Canty plunged into the deep end of the hot-take pool.

On FS1, he said there are some in the Steelers organization that are “praying” that Ben Roethlisberger retires.

"There are people in the Steelers organization praying Big Ben retires. That would give them a few more options on how they're going to manage their salary cap. The 2-year, $68M contract extension they gave him last offseason looks like an awful deal right now." — @ChrisCanty99 pic.twitter.com/BmgpGkTTb7

— First Things First (@FTFonFS1) February 11, 2020
Canty doesn’t specify who those people are. Based on attempting to catch passes from Mason Rudolph and Devlin Hodges, my guess is that those people are not the wide receivers.

If what Canty is suggesting is that the Steelers privately think that Roethlisberger is washed up and that his elbow is shot — maybe.

But if that’s true, no one has put their name to that.

And the Steelers are in no position to draft his replacement without a first-round pick in 2020.

Or, if they were to cut him — as Bleacher Report suggested — Roethlisberger’s release would only save $8.5 million, which wouldn’t exactly open up enough free cap space to acquire his replacement on the open market via a trade or free agency.

Moving forward on the hope that Roethlisberger’s elbow is going to be OK is a risk. It’s also one that the Steelers are best positioned to take.

After spending 17 years in the quarterback desert, I don’t see the Steelers adopting the “let’s make a move one year too early, as opposed to one year too late” mentality with Roethlisberger.

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Post by Professor Half Wit » Wed Feb 12, 2020 6:53 pm

LakecrestSteeler wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 4:53 pm
Professor Half Wit wrote:
Wed Feb 12, 2020 3:07 pm
tbsteel wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:53 pm
Going into next season with Daniel Carver and Duck Hodges as our backups is completely reckless, and will very likely fuck us at some point next season. Just like it fucked us out of the playoffs this year.
Meant to comment on this.

It might be reckless, but given their cap and given their retention priorities, they are not going to be able to sign anyone better. What crucial piece do you expect them to cut to upgrade the back up quality?
Couldn’t you just do a 2 year guaranteed deal for $1 the first year and then $25,000,000 the second year or whatever the going rate is for a quality back-up is over 2 years.
Sure you could provided a quality back up of quality is motivated to sign such a transparently poor deal? And who is going to agree to sign a one year deal for a million that is better than Mason?

We can complain that the Steelers should not be in the cap situation in which they find themselves, but here we are. I don't see how they can sign a back up of real quality and not lose a key piece someplace else.

It's Ben or bust, boys.

Maybe a cap guru can see a way to it.
"Just don't kill us."

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Post by truckstoppornpatron » Wed Feb 12, 2020 10:08 pm

Landry Jones was the answer. Coulda been had for a few years cheap. Maybe Signstein can crunch the #'s and chime in on our current situation.

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