what kind of deal they will offer #7 to stay?

A place to talk Steelers football and what else is going on around the NFL
stillthere
Posts: 5209
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:37 am

Re: what kind of deal they will offer #7 to stay?

Post by stillthere » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:25 pm

Scunge wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 1:20 am

The downside of that is that exact number of $14,340,000 will be due in 2022 if Ben retires or is cut.
They can designate the cut as a post June 1st and they can split that 14 million over 2 years and get the hit down to 7 million dead money each year as well.

I don't completely disagree with ripping the bandaid off all at once and going hard into rebuild. I also think that he deserves another season for what he brought to the team, city, fandom.



User avatar
tbsteel
Posts: 5622
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:19 pm

Post by tbsteel » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:28 pm

Ice wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 8:43 pm
A whole lot of 10 yard out patterns. I literally can't think of a really memorable Drew Brees play. Like pouring water on cardboard and watching it dry.
That's not a good argument. You can say the same thing about Brady. Quick, what are your top 5 Tom Brady passes? How about Peyton Manning? Do you think Ben is on their level too? Just because a guy is "boring" doesn't mean they're not great or better than guys with flashier plays/moments.

Ben has has some incredibly awesome moments, most notably the pass to Holmes that won the SB and the miracle tackle in the Colts game. Those are all-time plays that are etched into the memory of NFL fans forever. That's genuinely awesome. And since you've probably watched every Ben Roethlisberger game he's ever played, you'll have a ton of great memories and moments to look back on fondly. He was an GD playmaker who has an amazing highlight reel. And it makes sense, we're die-hard Steeler fans, that's what we do. But how many of Drew Brees' games have you watched in full? 10%? Less? New Orleans fans are going to have a ton of fond memories to look back on that are unique to them. They're gonna remember stuff like Brees on a 3rd and 20 down 6 late against the Patriots throwing a dime into double coverage in the back of the end zone to take the lead. Stuff that we maybe only saw a passing highlight of in a middle of a bunch of others, that are so huge in the minds of fans of Brees and the Saints.

User avatar
anpsteel
Posts: 151
Joined: Sun Oct 06, 2019 9:47 pm

Post by anpsteel » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:30 pm

Pabst wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 8:28 pm
anpsteel wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 7:57 pm
In respect to Brees: while NO has had some amazing offensive weapons, and much better play calling, over the years, you'd be challendged to suggest their overall rosters were on par with the Steelers over that period of time.

When compared to GB, there isn't a facet of that teams roster that has been better than the Steelers over the duration. - Possibly, including coaching.
Saints Roster:
2017: 7 Pro Bowl, 2 All Pro
2018: 8 Pro Bowl, 5 All Pro
2019: 11 Pro Bowl, 6 All Pro
2020: 5 Pro Bowl, 0 All Pro


Steelers Roster:
2017: 10 Pro Bowl, 4 All Pro
2018: 8 Pro Bowl, 1 All Pro
2019: 6 Pro Bowl, 5 All Pro
2020: 5 Pro Bowl, 3 All Pro


I'll go ahead and suggest that the Saints roster was at least on par with the Steelers.

Green Bay is a bit more spotty, but they had 6 players named to the AP All Pro team this season (twice as many as Pittsburgh). If you want to go back to the 2010 season, Green Bay had 6 Pro Bowl players and 3 All Pros.....Steelers had 4 and 3, respectively. The following year, GB had 7 & 3 while Pittsburgh had 7 & 2.
You have to go back to when Rogers started, 2008. The Steelers have had 9 more pro-bowl players over that period. (I've had this conversation before. lol)

User avatar
Ice
Posts: 1941
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:41 pm
Location: Delawhere?

Post by Ice » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:49 pm

Between Brees' inflated counting stats and cardboard consistency and Ben's dynamic playmaking, I'll take Ben's dynamic playmaking any day of the week and twice on Sundays. Since you keep trying to bring Rogers, Brady and Manning into the A and B comparison, Brady not only has more memorable plays and moments than Brees, he has 7 times more SB wins. Manning? Made 4 win talent into a playoff team for years. Rogers, a lot like Ben, Favre, Steve Young, Mahomes, Elway... that's a QB I'd pay to see. Make it a point to watch their games. Why would I make time to watch paint dry. You can keep your hype, one Lombardi, and overblown longevity stats. I'll go with wins, playoff wins, YPA, two Lombardis and the eye test.

While we're at it, I'll take Lynn Swann over Reggie Wayne with the game on the line, as well.
Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile...

User avatar
Pabst
Posts: 2092
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 8:14 pm

Post by Pabst » Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:52 pm

anpsteel wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 9:30 pm
You have to go back to when Rogers started, 2008. The Steelers have had 9 more pro-bowl players over that period. (I've had this conversation before. lol)

Since 2008, Pittsburgh has had 65 pro bowl players. New Orleans 64, Green Bay 57. (I'm using wikipedia, so feel free to correct these numbers)

Green Bay: 132 regular season wins, 10 playoff appearances, 11 playoff wins, 1 Super Bowl Appearance, 1 win
Pittsburgh: 135 regular season wins, 8 playoff appearances, 8 playoff wins, 2 Super Bowl Appearances, 1 win
New Orleans: 133 regular seasons wins, 8 playoff appearances, 8 playoff wins, 1 Super Bowl Appearance, 1 win

All 3 franchises have been pretty dang even over that span.

MWS71
Posts: 10
Joined: Tue Nov 17, 2020 3:05 am

Post by MWS71 » Tue Feb 09, 2021 10:11 pm

Maybe it's because the season just ended, but I'm really not looking forward to the slew of "best shape of his life" articles that will undoubtedly come along with any contract extension Ben might get.

Reading camp reports in July and lying to myself about "maybe with an extra year post surgery his arm will be better!" Obviously I'll do that, but...it sounds exhausting.

The bottom line is Ben could not consistently throw the ball down the field this year. Not enough to build a gameplan around it. Not even enough to keep defenses honest so that they didn't load up against the short passing game. I'd choose even a chance of re-signing Bud over bringing Ben back.

Scunge
Posts: 2685
Joined: Thu Sep 26, 2019 1:53 pm

Post by Scunge » Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:39 pm

I get the idea that there is a camp that wants to see Ben decide when to hang it up. That they want to see him play his last season, games in front of the home fans in Pittsburgh, and of those displaced fans in other cities. What makes any of you think that Wolf will allow fans in the stadium come this fall?? That things will return to normal and 66,000 fans will return to the stadium at a mere snap of the fingers???

Many criticize me and my supposed treatment of our beloved vets at the end of their careers. Think of me as a disciple of Chuck Noll, the greatest coach this team ever had. He was not sentimental, he knew when the time had come and that players should, "Get on with their life's work"

A couple years back when Ben was doing his, will I come back, I will have to think about it, pray on it, shtick/gimmick/routine, I wondered how Chuck Noll would have handled that. I daydreamed what Noll's response would have been. I do think Ben would have quickly gotten a message and never uttered those words again.

I keep coming back to this, why would Ben want to come back? With the exception of David DeCastro at RG, the rest of that O-line will be different.

Who is the LT? Okorafora? A 1st//2nd/3rd round rookie?
Who is the LG? Does Matt Feiler resign with the Steelers? Is it Dotson instead?
Who is the C? Do they rely on a 2nd or 3rd round rookie? Do they play Hassenauer?
Who is the RT? Do they keep Okorafora at RT? Does he move to LT and Banner comes back to play at RT? Is Feiler resigned and he plays at RT?

Who is the TE? The TE to complement Ebron? Will Ebron be cut as well??

Will JuJu leave for the NY Jets or some other bigger city?
Will Conner leave as well?

Matt Canada will be challenged with all of this upheaval on the offensive side of the ball. And to make his job more difficult he will have an old QB who doesn't move well. That O-line is not going to gel overnight and it will probably get Ben hurt. I suspect that Rudolph might easily get 3 starts anyway.

The way I look at it, rip that band aid off now, encourage retirement, then you have a full $19 million to help for the rebuild effort and you don't have to deal with dead money in 2022. And again, if you start Rudolph and go 8-8, or 6-10, then so be it. Having the 12-15th pick in the draft gives you a great start in rebuilding this team.

Stosh-67
Posts: 7461
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:18 pm

Post by Stosh-67 » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:16 am

Kodiak wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 5:26 am
Hard to keep up with the rules changes, but if they add dummy years and Ben retires after next season I think they can spread the cap hit over two years.

But while most people want to kick Ben to the curb now, I suspect Ben and the Steelers are planning for the possibility he may be willing and able to play into 2022 and beyond.

So, yes, there is a negotiation taking place for all parties to protect themselves. It's plainly obvious - if everyone agreed this is Ben's last year, adding a few dummy years to spread the cap hit would be trivial. At Week 11, the guy was in the MVP running.

I'm not in a hurry to dump Ben to rebuild a team run by Mike Tomlin. Odds are we won't get another franchise QB for at least a decade. The people gnashing their teeth over Ben's salary/cap hit are bedwetting - a few years without a franchise QB and you're forced to overpay JAGs to meet the cap requirements. It's a non-issue.
Best comment of this thread.
Top 5 anyway.

Who knows, maybe Pouncey retires or is cut.
Save some money by not being able to afford both JuJu and Bud,
They sign Dupree.
Cut Haden or re-work to a PS friendly deal.
Extend DD to reduce cap.
Extend Nelson to reduce cap.
Extend Tuit to reduce cap.
Let Connor, Villy and Feiler go, to help sign others.
Sign Sutton.
Try and sign Hilton.
Vince is cut or reduced salary.
Vance retiring saved some money.

And then knock it out of the park in the draft again with a LT, C, TE and RB with 4 of first 5 picks. Defense with the rest.

Bush come back. Dupree is back, pissed off Watt aims for his best year.....
Layne and or Pierre come on.
Year 2 Chase explodes. Washington finally gets full duty, DJ works on hands in offseason. Ebron too.

If all that happens.........
And its not really anything crazy, like signing a big FA ( other than Bud )

Do we want to leave a pretty talented team to Mason, Dobbs and Haskins?

Stosh-67
Posts: 7461
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:18 pm

Post by Stosh-67 » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:27 am

Ice wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 6:36 pm
The yards, well, look at the systems. Brees has played in a stat-padding system his entire Saints career, against a division that has fielded some lousy defenses, even compared to the North. The All Pros and Pro Bowls? That's media hype. Postseason wins, YPA, Super Bowls... Ben has some things going for him as well.
Drew also played in a large living room with nice perfect wall to wall carpet, no weather, no rain, sleet, snow or wind and the thermostat set at 68 degrees fahrenheit, for 8 homes games a year, 9th road game in a dome vs Atlanta, 10th road in great weather in TB. 11th in Carolina.

Kodiak
Posts: 18372
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 8:43 pm

Post by Kodiak » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:31 am

Stosh-67 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:16 am
Do we want to leave a pretty talented team to Mason, Dobbs and Haskins?
Vegas odds have PIT at #11. In my mind, that's probably about right. A potential contender with some holes. They may choose to let Bud walk because of Highsmith, but otherwise I expect everyone on defense back, and think they'll find a way to sign Bud.

To read this board, you'd think we were like 28th in need of blowing it all up. Fix the OL, Ben has an offseason to rediscover his accuracy on the deep ball and you have a chance...
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben comes back, Tomlin doesn't = CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

User avatar
jewelsongs
Posts: 297
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 8:14 pm

Post by jewelsongs » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:38 am

Dave Bryan at Steelers Depot had a well thought out look at the situation, postulating serveral variables to consider in this decision. To summarize his position, he had Ben signing a contract with 3 voidable years after this one, a minimium salary, and a signing bonus for the rest of what he is owed. That stretched the money Ben gets this year for cap purposes over 4 years. The language in the voidable clauses indicates that the voidable date would occur after June 1st of next year. So Ben costs $4M this year. We save $15M this year. We void the contract next year, and the rest becomes a cap charge two years from now when the salary cap is back to normal and Watt, Fitz, possibly a new contract for Bud can be handled this year and next.

His article also had agreements between Ben and the team. Ben must run Canada's offense, and not call most of the plays at the line of scrimmage. If the offense is not performing because of Ben, We move to Rudolph to see what he can do while he is still under contract. Ben gets a last hurrah and we get back some cap room.

I have been in the "Ben should retire" camp, but this seems like a good compromise to me.

User avatar
tbsteel
Posts: 5622
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:19 pm

Post by tbsteel » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:43 am

Scunge wrote:
Tue Feb 09, 2021 11:39 pm
I get the idea that there is a camp that wants to see Ben decide when to hang it up. That they want to see him play his last season, games in front of the home fans in Pittsburgh, and of those displaced fans in other cities. What makes any of you think that Wolf will allow fans in the stadium come this fall?? That things will return to normal and 66,000 fans will return to the stadium at a mere snap of the fingers???

Many criticize me and my supposed treatment of our beloved vets at the end of their careers. Think of me as a disciple of Chuck Noll, the greatest coach this team ever had. He was not sentimental, he knew when the time had come and that players should, "Get on with their life's work"

A couple years back when Ben was doing his, will I come back, I will have to think about it, pray on it, shtick/gimmick/routine, I wondered how Chuck Noll would have handled that. I daydreamed what Noll's response would have been. I do think Ben would have quickly gotten a message and never uttered those words again.

I keep coming back to this, why would Ben want to come back? With the exception of David DeCastro at RG, the rest of that O-line will be different.

Who is the LT? Okorafora? A 1st//2nd/3rd round rookie?
Who is the LG? Does Matt Feiler resign with the Steelers? Is it Dotson instead?
Who is the C? Do they rely on a 2nd or 3rd round rookie? Do they play Hassenauer?
Who is the RT? Do they keep Okorafora at RT? Does he move to LT and Banner comes back to play at RT? Is Feiler resigned and he plays at RT?

Who is the TE? The TE to complement Ebron? Will Ebron be cut as well??

Will JuJu leave for the NY Jets or some other bigger city?
Will Conner leave as well?

Matt Canada will be challenged with all of this upheaval on the offensive side of the ball. And to make his job more difficult he will have an old QB who doesn't move well. That O-line is not going to gel overnight and it will probably get Ben hurt. I suspect that Rudolph might easily get 3 starts anyway.

The way I look at it, rip that band aid off now, encourage retirement, then you have a full $19 million to help for the rebuild effort and you don't have to deal with dead money in 2022. And again, if you start Rudolph and go 8-8, or 6-10, then so be it. Having the 12-15th pick in the draft gives you a great start in rebuilding this team.
Great perspective here, Scrunge. Thanks for posting.

And that's what I keep coming back to in all of this: it seems like there's a disconnect between Ben and the reality facing this team. "I don't care what I get paid this season! We'll bring my bud Pouncey back, and my safety net Juju, and Big Al and Bud... let's run it back! Let's win one more... for me!"

Juju and Bud are gone. Bud was gone the second they decided not to sign him long-term and slapped the franchise tag on him. I would gladly bet anyone on here $100 he'll be playing with another team next season. It's over, Johnny! As for Juju, why would he want to come back here? To sign a long-term deal just to play one more season with the Gipper and then what? To come back and be a glorified dump off option to get 4-5 yard passes where he has to fight for every single yard while getting his clock cleaned damn near every reception? I can't remember the last time I saw a Steelers WR punished as much as JJSS was this past season. He played his ass off but he was getting lit up by 2-3 defenders damn near every catch. And he knows the Steelers plan this offseason is to rejuvenate the run game and get back to running the ball. I'm sure he's pumped! There is more money and better situations to be had on the open market.

Next season is year 1 of a rebuild, whether they want to admit it or not. There is going to be a mass exodus of players. We will not be as good a team next season as we were this year. This isn't a championship roster with or without Ben. He wants to have some fairytale career ending like his idol Elway did or like Bettis got to go out with... that isn't going to happen with him. For every Elway there are scores of other great players who went out like a fart in the wind... like Marino getting destroyed against Jacksonville in the playoffs, or Brett Favre knocked out on a sack in an awful 6-10 season wearing a Vikings uniform and never playing another down. I figure Ben's end will be pretty similar to Favre's. That Vikings team reminds me of the Steelers in some ways... holding out hope they can run it back again, traded a 3rd round pick to New England to bring back Randy Moss with Favre, traded up in the second round of the draft to grab Toby Gebhart to pair with AD, being aggressive, trying to hold it together... then Favre fell apart, Moss was cut a month into the season, and it all went to shit from there. Then they really bottomed out the next season. I hope that doesn't happen here.

I still think there's a legitimate chance that Ben ends up hanging it up this offseason for many of the same reasons above. When it sets in that Bud is gone, and Juju is gone, and Big Al is probably gone, and Hilton and/or Sutton are gone, and Vance is already gone, and shit now Pouncey is sticking to retiring, and Fichtner is already gone and they're rolling with this Canada guy who runs shit I just don't like... what is he coming back to?

If he wants to come back then he's definitely earned that right. But the Steelers can't pretend like time is just gonna stop and ignore that they're gonna have a team post-Ben. Their moves now need to be about securing as many quality young players as they can, acquiring as many lottery ticket draft picks they can, and finding the next QB ASAP. Their focus this year can't be on keeping all their vets like Ben, Pouncey, Haden, DeCastro, Alaalu, Big Al and letting their promising young players leave in FA just to run it back with Ben. Look in the mirror and make the right decisions for the future of the club.

User avatar
K_C_
Posts: 18301
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:37 pm
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Contact:

Post by K_C_ » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:02 am

Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:31 am
Stosh-67 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:16 am
Do we want to leave a pretty talented team to Mason, Dobbs and Haskins?
Vegas odds have PIT at #11. In my mind, that's probably about right. A potential contender with some holes. They may choose to let Bud walk because of Highsmith, but otherwise I expect everyone on defense back, and think they'll find a way to sign Bud.

To read this board, you'd think we were like 28th in need of blowing it all up. Fix the OL, Ben has an offseason to rediscover his accuracy on the deep ball and you have a chance...
I have us closer to 28th than 11th, that's for goddamn sure.

Other teams are making improvements too. The Browns are young, talented and improving. The Ravens have some big free agents, but they aren't going to fall far. The Bengals are likely going to deal their 5th pick for a very nice haul. Don't be surprised if they end up with a few first rounders this April.

Then you have a very rough schedule coming up for the Steelers and their ancient QB who looked more and more exhausted as the year went on.

I guess we'll see what happens, but I'm not buying for a second the Steelers are a serous contender for anything other than a top 10 pick.
"In my opinion, he is a great motivator and good leader of men, but a shit tactician and absolutely game day imbecile".

Baltostiller

User avatar
tbsteel
Posts: 5622
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 2:19 pm

Post by tbsteel » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:14 am

Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:31 am
They may choose to let Bud walk because of Highsmith, but otherwise I expect everyone on defense back, and think they'll find a way to sign Bud.
Bless you sweet summer child...

User avatar
K_C_
Posts: 18301
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:37 pm
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Contact:

Post by K_C_ » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:16 am

tbsteel wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:14 am
Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:31 am
They may choose to let Bud walk because of Highsmith, but otherwise I expect everyone on defense back, and think they'll find a way to sign Bud.
Bless you sweet summer child...
The Steelers have as good a chance at re-signing Dupree, as Dwayne Haskins does of being All Pro this year.
"In my opinion, he is a great motivator and good leader of men, but a shit tactician and absolutely game day imbecile".

Baltostiller

Havoc
Posts: 5515
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2019 1:35 pm

Post by Havoc » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:02 am

K_C_ wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:02 am
Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:31 am
Stosh-67 wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:16 am
Do we want to leave a pretty talented team to Mason, Dobbs and Haskins?
Vegas odds have PIT at #11. In my mind, that's probably about right. A potential contender with some holes. They may choose to let Bud walk because of Highsmith, but otherwise I expect everyone on defense back, and think they'll find a way to sign Bud.

To read this board, you'd think we were like 28th in need of blowing it all up. Fix the OL, Ben has an offseason to rediscover his accuracy on the deep ball and you have a chance...
I have us closer to 28th than 11th, that's for goddamn sure.

Other teams are making improvements too. The Browns are young, talented and improving. The Ravens have some big free agents, but they aren't going to fall far. The Bengals are likely going to deal their 5th pick for a very nice haul. Don't be surprised if they end up with a few first rounders this April.

Then you have a very rough schedule coming up for the Steelers and their ancient QB who looked more and more exhausted as the year went on.

I guess we'll see what happens, but I'm not buying for a second the Steelers are a serous contender for anything other than a top 10 pick.
Noone in our division scares me although I respect the browns and ravens ability to usher an ass kicking on a given day.

Chances are, the league has already seen the best of Jackson.

I doubt Baker is ever going to be special.

Joe hasn't done shit in this league, we'll see with him.

The division is up for grabs.
Throw. The. Football. On. First. Down.

Jobu
Posts: 11635
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:58 pm

Post by Jobu » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:12 am

K_C_ wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:16 am
tbsteel wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:14 am
Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:31 am
They may choose to let Bud walk because of Highsmith, but otherwise I expect everyone on defense back, and think they'll find a way to sign Bud.
Bless you sweet summer child...
The Steelers have as good a chance at re-signing Dupree, as Dwayne Haskins does of being All Pro this year.
Yeah I’d go with this. The Steelers made a run at re-signing Depree last offseason. He chose the tag and FA. He’ll be signed away within 2 hours of FA opening. I would suspect there won’t be any further negotiations between the two parties.

User avatar
Ice
Posts: 1941
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:41 pm
Location: Delawhere?

Post by Ice » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:50 am

I'll go with my own ASOIAF reference. If you trust the current leadership to "gather as many lottery ticket picks as they can and go find the next QB," you haven't been paying attention.
Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile...

Jobu
Posts: 11635
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:58 pm

Post by Jobu » Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:53 am

Ice wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:50 am
I'll go with my own ASOIAF reference. If you trust the current leadership to "gather as many lottery ticket picks as they can and go find the next QB," you haven't been paying attention.
Sometimes you get lucky... ;)

User avatar
Ice
Posts: 1941
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:41 pm
Location: Delawhere?

Post by Ice » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:03 am

One can only hope "we had a first round grade on Bibberty" was post-draft bravado. If not, it's going to take a lot more than luck.

A chance at contention next year and a last season with our aging HOF warhorse holds a little more appeal when one begins to consider the lengthy wander through the desert we're very likely in for afterwards.
Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile...

Havoc
Posts: 5515
Joined: Tue Sep 24, 2019 1:35 pm

Post by Havoc » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:17 am

Ice wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:03 am
One can only hope "we had a first round grade on Bibberty" was post-draft bravado. If not, it's going to take a lot more than luck.

A chance at contention next year and a last season with our aging HOF warhorse holds a little more appeal when one begins to consider the lengthy wander through the desert we're very likely in for afterwards.
A chance at contending for the playoffs and maybe winning a playoff game.

If we have Aaron Rodgers or Steve Young waiting in the wings, then yeah you have to go with the next young gun.

If Ben had the arm strength of Peyton's final year or Brees this year then yeah, I would be ok with entering the QB abyss.

Ben can still push the football downfield. I want him on the field next year.
Throw. The. Football. On. First. Down.

User avatar
Ice
Posts: 1941
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:41 pm
Location: Delawhere?

Post by Ice » Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:26 am

Yup, another fun ride (and yeah, the first 11 games, as well as the win against my buddy's Colts team in dramatic fashion, on balance, qualified) for a year before wading through the inevitable suck for God knows how long? Sign me up, I'm good with it.
Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile...

Kodiak
Posts: 18372
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 8:43 pm

Post by Kodiak » Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:08 am

Havoc wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:17 am
Ben can still push the football downfield. I want him on the field next year.
Bravo. I predict a lot of people will be eating their words, and next offseason with FA Ben will have a very different context. The guy can still play - if he's old Brett Favre at this point, well that's still a lot better than what we have or what we're likely to land in the draft.


Image
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben comes back, Tomlin doesn't = CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

Kodiak
Posts: 18372
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 8:43 pm

Post by Kodiak » Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:11 am

K_C_ wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:16 am
The Steelers have as good a chance at re-signing Dupree, as Dwayne Haskins does of being All Pro this year.
They could also find a way to tag him again.

Keep the window open one more final year. Or attempt to preserve mediocrity into the foreseeable future [which most poasters here seem to be cuckolding themselves over].
-----------------------------------------------------------------------
Ben comes back, Tomlin doesn't = CHAMPIONSHIP!!!

Jobu
Posts: 11635
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 5:58 pm

Post by Jobu » Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:01 am

Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:11 am
K_C_ wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:16 am
The Steelers have as good a chance at re-signing Dupree, as Dwayne Haskins does of being All Pro this year.
They could also find a way to tag him again.

Keep the window open one more final year. Or attempt to preserve mediocrity into the foreseeable future [which most poasters here seem to be cuckolding themselves over].
Wouldn’t that be like over $20m? Where do they come up with the cap space for that? I think you guys wishing for a way to keep DuPree to suddenly come up, are going to be disappointed. We did this last year with Hargrave.
There were a lot of guys here that kept saying that constantly kicking the can down the road would one day come to a head. That day is rapidly approaching, I fear.

stillthere
Posts: 5209
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 9:37 am

Post by stillthere » Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:37 am

Jobu wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 11:01 am
There were a lot of guys here that kept saying that constantly kicking the can down the road would one day come to a head. That day is rapidly approaching, I fear.
it is really just this year because the cap is going down. If the cap stayed the same or if it dropped a couple of million down to say 195 million then Pittsburgh would not really be in the cap hell they are in this season. If the cap went down to 195 they could do the same restructures they are going to do now and probably had enough money to re-sign either Bud or JuJu and an outside chance at both if one or both took a deal that was a little back loaded.

In 2023 I think the only player with a salary cap hit is Cam Heyward and the rookie class from the 2020 season. Obviously you are going to have to add Watt and Fitzpatrick contracts along with some others. But the team in general after this season has a pretty clean slate to work with.

User avatar
Professor Half Wit
Posts: 2166
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 7:23 pm

Post by Professor Half Wit » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:09 pm

Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:08 am
Havoc wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 3:17 am
Ben can still push the football downfield. I want him on the field next year.
Bravo. I predict a lot of people will be eating their words, and next offseason with FA Ben will have a very different context. The guy can still play - if he's old Brett Favre at this point, well that's still a lot better than what we have or what we're likely to land in the draft.


Image
Meh.

Ben can still push the ball down field, no doubt.

What we did not see him do was push it down field consistently with accuracy. Lots of errant throws.

Jury still out on who Ben is at this point.

I expect more of the same next year. There is no reason not to. Flashes of brilliance that make you think he's still got it followed by less than he's-still-got-it play.

Ben needs a top notch nasty run game. Do we really have the cash and pieces and draft capital to make that happen by next year?
"Just don't kill us."

User avatar
jeemie
Posts: 1978
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 10:32 pm

Post by jeemie » Wed Feb 10, 2021 12:48 pm

Ice wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 2:50 am
I'll go with my own ASOIAF reference. If you trust the current leadership to "gather as many lottery ticket picks as they can and go find the next QB," you haven't been paying attention.
But you trust this leadership to win with a roster full of holes and a 39 year old QB that can’t outplay his coaching anymore?

User avatar
K_C_
Posts: 18301
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:37 pm
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Contact:

Post by K_C_ » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:40 pm

Kodiak wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 5:11 am
K_C_ wrote:
Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:16 am
The Steelers have as good a chance at re-signing Dupree, as Dwayne Haskins does of being All Pro this year.
They could also find a way to tag him again.

Keep the window open one more final year. Or attempt to preserve mediocrity into the foreseeable future [which most poasters here seem to be cuckolding themselves over].
The window is 100% already closed.
"In my opinion, he is a great motivator and good leader of men, but a shit tactician and absolutely game day imbecile".

Baltostiller

User avatar
K_C_
Posts: 18301
Joined: Sun Sep 22, 2019 6:37 pm
Location: Boca Raton, Florida
Contact:

Post by K_C_ » Wed Feb 10, 2021 1:56 pm

This is unreal.

We're about to have a roster overhaul and Roethlisberger (who now makes Philip Rivers look like Randall Cunningham) played one good half in the final 6 games and there are folks that still think the Steeler window for a championship is still open.

Holy shit.
"In my opinion, he is a great motivator and good leader of men, but a shit tactician and absolutely game day imbecile".

Baltostiller

Post Reply Previous topicNext topic