SF Podcast: Steelers Mock Draft War Room Parts 1 & 2

[bradshaw2ben]

Yes, friends, it's time for our annual foray into debating and selecting all the Steelers picks. Now that every show and their brothers are doing something similar, I'd like to point out that we did this in 2009 and every year since!

Sometimes it's frustrating, sometimes we think we did amazingly well, only for our choice not to work out at all, and on rare occasions, we do it right... in the words of Forrest Gump, "You never know which one you're gonna get."

On this occasion, I would say it didn't go *exactly* how we planned... but judge for yourselves!

Steelers Mock Draft War Room Part 1:
Audio: https://www.spreaker.com/episode/steele ... --59569754
Video: https://youtu.be/cy2iLJ_kaqc?si=2CZ7FzKgwYFlEOYG

Steelers Mock Draft War Room Part 2
Audio: https://www.spreaker.com/episode/steele ... --59569813
Video: https://youtu.be/4w_YMWcsZyE?si=oyO0mu1hWPSQkxkP

[SteelerDayTrader]

Not a big fan of 1 and 2 at those slots

Feels a little like 2 reaches for need in addition to both having some issues

I like the reasoning for 3 and the player but I would’ve waited on pick for that position til a little later

Great podcast

[SteelerDayTrader]

Part 2…..

Don’t like drafting a 4.6 RB there

The rest are understandable

[bradshaw2ben]

Part 2…..

Don’t like drafting a 4.6 RB there

The rest are understandable

Unless I forgot which player we took, that last recorded time to Allen was 4.46 last year, not 4.6

[SteelerDayTrader]

Part 2…..

Don’t like drafting a 4.6 RB there

The rest are understandable

Unless I forgot which player we took, that last recorded time to Allen was 4.46 last year, not 4.6

My mistake then……and good news…..I want to like Allen

[franco32]

Great work. I'm a big fan of trading back in this draft to get more capital.

Obviously missing out on WR was the big hole there.

[bradshaw2ben]

I mean, it illustrates how difficult it is to get WR that fits if you miss out in Rd 1. We didn't have a chance to trade down for anything meaningful so the exercise more or less forced us into a narrow window. I planted the seed before we even started that getting a WR was going to be tough if we didn't take one in rd 1.

That said, Javon Baker would be the lowest-ranked guy I think could not only start in the NFL in 2024, but could actually be great. And David White is a perfect lesser-known guy to take a shot on.

But the more of these exercises I do (I've now done 3 "official" mocks picking for the Steelers and of course many web mocks), the more I'm convinced that taking OT/C/CB in round 1 should be immediately followed by the announcement of a trade for Brandon Aiyuk for pick 51 or the all-out effort to trade up as far as possible from 51. I'm not worried about getting an OT or C even as deep as pick 119. But an outside WR with some juice who is ready to at least be an average starter... not too many after pick 12 or so.

[Ice]

Do Tomkhan bust the "first round pick must have been brought to Pittsburgh/had a massive Steeler contingent at Pro Day" paradigm for WR is, I guess the question, since most of the guys they've brought in really seem to fit in the pick 51-ish hole.

[Mick]

I’m not a fan of focus on ‘fit’. You are never going to go wrong taking the better player, you are almost always going to go wrong taking the guy that fits your plan.

WR in particular, seems like a massive dropoff after the first 10 or so from guys that are already great after three years to a bunch of 5th year guys in the WR 11-20 range that still aren’t very good in college.

I have to think that if we haven’t addressed WR after two rounds, the plan isn’t to address it in round 3, the real plan is to Tonya Harding Picken’s knee and then address the QB position with the 1st overall pick in 2025.

[bradshaw2ben]

I’m not a fan of focus on ‘fit’. You are never going to go wrong taking the better player, you are almost always going to go wrong taking the guy that fits your plan.

WR in particular, seems like a massive dropoff after the first 10 or so from guys that are already great after three years to a bunch of 5th year guys in the WR 11-20 range that still aren’t very good in college.

I have to think that if we haven’t addressed WR after two rounds, the plan isn’t to address it in round 3, the real plan is to Tonya Harding Picken’s knee and then address the QB position with the 1st overall pick in 2025.

That's more or less what we did, aside from the Hardinging Pickens' knee part. They seem to be so, so, all about winning this yer that I fear they will be overly fit/readiness obsessed this year. we're going to get a bunch of win-now guys with high floors.

[Stillchest]

I’m not a fan of focus on ‘fit’. You are never going to go wrong taking the better player, you are almost always going to go wrong taking the guy that fits your plan.

WR in particular, seems like a massive dropoff after the first 10 or so from guys that are already great after three years to a bunch of 5th year guys in the WR 11-20 range that still aren’t very good in college.

I have to think that if we haven’t addressed WR after two rounds, the plan isn’t to address it in round 3, the real plan is to Tonya Harding Picken’s knee and then address the QB position with the 1st overall pick in 2025.

That's more or less what we did, aside from the Hardinging Pickens' knee part. They seem to be so, so, all about winning this yer that I fear they will be overly fit/readiness obsessed this year. we're going to get a bunch of win-now guys with high floors.

Until the football philosophy changes the seasonal results will be similar.

[franco32]

I mean, it illustrates how difficult it is to get WR that fits if you miss out in Rd 1. We didn't have a chance to trade down for anything meaningful so the exercise more or less forced us into a narrow window. I planted the seed before we even started that getting a WR was going to be tough if we didn't take one in rd 1.

That said, Javon Baker would be the lowest-ranked guy I think could not only start in the NFL in 2024, but could actually be great. And David White is a perfect lesser-known guy to take a shot on.

But the more of these exercises I do (I've now done 3 "official" mocks picking for the Steelers and of course many web mocks), the more I'm convinced that taking OT/C/CB in round 1 should be immediately followed by the announcement of a trade for Brandon Aiyuk for pick 51 or the all-out effort to trade up as far as possible from 51. I'm not worried about getting an OT or C even as deep as pick 119. But an outside WR with some juice who is ready to at least be an average starter... not too many after pick 12 or so.

I'm getting Pearsall in most of my mocks at 51. So I don't know that we have to be that desperate to trade up. (In fact I hate losing draft capital in this draft.). I'm convinced Rds 2 and 3 are the sweet spot of this draft and we should be stockpiling for those.

[bradshaw2ben]

I mean, it illustrates how difficult it is to get WR that fits if you miss out in Rd 1. We didn't have a chance to trade down for anything meaningful so the exercise more or less forced us into a narrow window. I planted the seed before we even started that getting a WR was going to be tough if we didn't take one in rd 1.

That said, Javon Baker would be the lowest-ranked guy I think could not only start in the NFL in 2024, but could actually be great. And David White is a perfect lesser-known guy to take a shot on.

But the more of these exercises I do (I've now done 3 "official" mocks picking for the Steelers and of course many web mocks), the more I'm convinced that taking OT/C/CB in round 1 should be immediately followed by the announcement of a trade for Brandon Aiyuk for pick 51 or the all-out effort to trade up as far as possible from 51. I'm not worried about getting an OT or C even as deep as pick 119. But an outside WR with some juice who is ready to at least be an average starter... not too many after pick 12 or so.

I'm getting Pearsall in most of my mocks at 51. So I don't know that we have to be that desperate to trade up. (In fact I hate losing draft capital in this draft.). I'm convinced Rds 2 and 3 are the sweet spot of this draft and we should be stockpiling for those.

In no way, shape, or form is Ricky Pearsall going to be a starter at the X position in the NFL, sorry. He *might* be a successful slot guy or work out playing the position on the other side the way Pickens does now, but them visiting with him boggles the mind. On top of that, if you're going to go for a slot type player and put him outside, then Pearsall would be like my 10th choice. Malik Washington, for starters.

[bradshaw2ben]

ELITE
no chance anywhere near pick 1.20 or a trade up:
Malik Nabers
Marvin Harrison Jr.
Rome Odunze

EXTREMELY GOOD. Has size/speed/talent to play X and be great WR2 or even WR1
Gone before 51:
Brian Thomas Jr.
Adonai Mitchell
Xavier Legette

REALLY GOOD, JUST LESS HYPED
Javon Baker

REALLY GOOD, BUT TOO SIMILAR TO PICKENS TYPE AND DOESN'T OFFER SPEED
Keon Coleman

LIKE DJ18, NOT AN OUTSIDE GUY BUT YOU COULD USE HIM THAT WAY
Malik Washington

SUPPOSED HEADCASE BUT IF NOT HE'S OKAY
Jermaine Burton

THEORETICALLY AN OUTSIDE WR BUT ALL HE DOES IS CATCH SCREENS AND RUN OVER PEOPLE
Malachi Corley

JOB #1 OF A WR IS TO CATCH THE BALL & IT'S NOT HIS ONLY ISSUE
Devontez Walker


NO WAY-- SLOT GUYS OF VARYING SIZES AND LIMITATIONS
Ladd McConkey
Troy Franklin
Ricky Pearsall
Roman Wilson
Xavier Worthy
Anthony Gould
Ja'Lynn Polk
Jacob Cowing


TAKE A FLYER LATER?
Bub Means
David White, Jr.
Cole Burgess
Ogie-Kellogg
Josh Cephus
Luke McCaffrey
Cornelius Johnson
Ryan Flournoy
Jalen Coker
Casey Washington

[Mick]

Pearsall is going to be a 24 year old rookie. For context, 0 of the top 10 WRs in the NFL last season were still playing college football at age 22. Expanding to the top 20 WRs from last season, you get 2 players that were 23 as rookies, and 18 that were younger. Still 0 that were 24 year old rookies.

I mean, I don’t dislike him as a prospect, but the more realistic hope for him is to be a legitimate #3 WR. Which isn’t what I usually want to hope for from a top 50ish pick.

[Orangesteel]

Hadn’t watched anything of Javon Baker and man…he looks excellent!

[bradshaw2ben]

Hadn’t watched anything of Javon Baker and man…he looks excellent!

This one right here... WOWsa

What I love most about it is the QB throws it to a sea of nowhere, the camera pans and there's no one there... just when you're thinking he's thrown the game away... in flies Baker:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=HRnW61mtyBE

[bradshaw2ben]

Pearsall is going to be a 24 year old rookie. For context, 0 of the top 10 WRs in the NFL last season were still playing college football at age 22. Expanding to the top 20 WRs from last season, you get 2 players that were 23 as rookies, and 18 that were younger. Still 0 that were 24 year old rookies.

I mean, I don’t dislike him as a prospect, but the more realistic hope for him is to be a legitimate #3 WR. Which isn’t what I usually want to hope for from a top 50ish pick.

I will say this: the COVID year is gonna screw up age analytics a little, because for many players in this class, it really messed with the season-- they didn't get anything close to a full, normal season for that year. Like, a small-school guy probably had no chance to declare early and get any traction so had to either go back or transfer to bigger school. Some of them were quite productive early in their career, just had no path to go to the NFL early. And then a guy like Baker (22), who had a slew of more highly-recruited NFL guys in front of him at Alabama, then blew up as soon as he got out of there. He's not a Kenny Pickett, finally succeeding in year 5 after 4 crap years.

Lastly, there are the really crazy stories like Quan'tez Stiggers (22) or David White, Jr. (24), where the pandemic and life just completely made a normal college path impossible.

[SteelerDayTrader]

I mean, it illustrates how difficult it is to get WR that fits if you miss out in Rd 1. We didn't have a chance to trade down for anything meaningful so the exercise more or less forced us into a narrow window. I planted the seed before we even started that getting a WR was going to be tough if we didn't take one in rd 1.

That said, Javon Baker would be the lowest-ranked guy I think could not only start in the NFL in 2024, but could actually be great. And David White is a perfect lesser-known guy to take a shot on.

But the more of these exercises I do (I've now done 3 "official" mocks picking for the Steelers and of course many web mocks), the more I'm convinced that taking OT/C/CB in round 1 should be immediately followed by the announcement of a trade for Brandon Aiyuk for pick 51 or the all-out effort to trade up as far as possible from 51. I'm not worried about getting an OT or C even as deep as pick 119. But an outside WR with some juice who is ready to at least be an average starter... not too many after pick 12 or so.

I'm getting Pearsall in most of my mocks at 51. So I don't know that we have to be that desperate to trade up. (In fact I hate losing draft capital in this draft.). I'm convinced Rds 2 and 3 are the sweet spot of this draft and we should be stockpiling for those.

Pearsall before the 4th = puke imo

[Orangesteel]

So safe to say we wouldn’t be unhappy if we went Round 1. Top 4 OT; Round 2. Top 3 C; Round 3. Javon Baker?

[meanjustinbarlow]

You guys could have nailed this if you would have taken Brian Thomas then grabbed a tackle at 98. They cancelled out RB when they signed Patterson, and Najee's 5th year option is actually a decent value in context of the RB contracts that went out this year. Love Frazier, and Sainristril. David White is a nice pick too. These are hard in the moment though.

Passing on Thomas put you behind the 8ball the rest of the draft.

[Orangesteel]

I was thinking maybe grab Thomas at 1.20 and then BPA C and BPA OT in the 2nd and 3rd.

Thomas and Pickens would be wild to watch, man.

[meanjustinbarlow]

You guys could have nailed this if you would have taken Brian Thomas then grabbed a tackle at 98. They cancelled out RB when they signed Patterson, and Najee's 5th year option is actually a decent value in context of the RB contracts that went out this year. Love Frazier, and Sainristril. David White is a nice pick too. These are hard in the moment though.

Passing on Thomas put you behind the 8ball the rest of the draft.

I do like White and Johnson though. Needed a sure thing though.

[Steelperch]

ELITE
no chance anywhere near pick 1.20 or a trade up:
Malik Nabers
Marvin Harrison Jr.
Rome Odunze

EXTREMELY GOOD. Has size/speed/talent to play X and be great WR2 or even WR1
Gone before 51:
Brian Thomas Jr.
Adonai Mitchell
Xavier Legette

REALLY GOOD, JUST LESS HYPED
Javon Baker

REALLY GOOD, BUT TOO SIMILAR TO PICKENS TYPE AND DOESN'T OFFER SPEED
Keon Coleman

LIKE DJ18, NOT AN OUTSIDE GUY BUT YOU COULD USE HIM THAT WAY
Malik Washington

SUPPOSED HEADCASE BUT IF NOT HE'S OKAY
Jermaine Burton

THEORETICALLY AN OUTSIDE WR BUT ALL HE DOES IS CATCH SCREENS AND RUN OVER PEOPLE
Malachi Corley

JOB #1 OF A WR IS TO CATCH THE BALL & IT'S NOT HIS ONLY ISSUE
Devontez Walker


NO WAY-- SLOT GUYS OF VARYING SIZES AND LIMITATIONS
Ladd McConkey
Troy Franklin
Ricky Pearsall
Roman Wilson
Xavier Worthy
Anthony Gould
Ja'Lynn Polk
Jacob Cowing


TAKE A FLYER LATER?
Bub Means
David White, Jr.
Cole Burgess
Ogie-Kellogg
Josh Cephus
Luke McCaffrey
Cornelius Johnson
Ryan Flournoy
Jalen Coker
Casey Washington

I agree with most of this but you lost me at:
NO WAY-- SLOT GUYS OF VARYING SIZES AND LIMITATIONS
Ladd McConkey
Troy Franklin
Ricky Pearsall
Roman Wilson
Xavier Worthy
Anthony Gould
Ja'Lynn Polk
Jacob Cowing

Specifically McConkey and Wilson can play outside and be a #2 WR.

[bradshaw2ben]

You guys could have nailed this if you would have taken Brian Thomas then grabbed a tackle at 98. They cancelled out RB when they signed Patterson, and Najee's 5th year option is actually a decent value in context of the RB contracts that went out this year. Love Frazier, and Sainristril. David White is a nice pick too. These are hard in the moment though.

Passing on Thomas put you behind the 8ball the rest of the draft.

Listen, I am with you. I'd not consider anybody in the Rd1 except a crazy outlier C or OT (Barton/Mims) or BTJ/Legette/AD. The more of this I do, the more convinced I am that you have to give up on Barton or Mims in rd 1 unless you somehow make the trade for Aiyuk (for pick 51 or something less than that, which would be a miracle).

Aside from this exercise, I did two other live drafts where I picked for the Steelers: the board draft here weeks ago and a draft this past weekend that Korey and I did.

Here are those two drafts:

Board draft for PIT:
1 20 Amarius Mims, OT, Georgia
2 51 TRADE: Brandon Aiyuk, WR
3 84 Hunter Nourzad, C, Penn State
3× 98 Jarvis Brownlee, Jr., CB, Florida State
4 128 Qwan'tez Stiggers, DB, Toronto Argonauts6 178 PIT - B2B - Tatum Bethune, LB, Florida State
6 189 Antonio Alfano, DE/EDGE, Lackawanna
6 195 Rasheen Ali, RB, Marshall
7 251 Jonah Laulu, DT, Oklahoma

Mock-A-Palooza:
1.20 Graham Barton, C, Duke
2.51 Kingsley Suamataia, OT, BYU (tried to trade up to every pick from 29- 32 when Xavier Legette went 1.28 and then AD Mitchell going 32)
3.84 Javon Baker, WR, UCF
3.98 Maason Smith, DL, LSU
4.119 Renardo Green, CB, Florida State
6.178 David White, Jr., WR, Western Carolina
6.195 Ryan Watts, DB, Texas

I'd really like to do another where I picked BTJ 1st and used the second half of mock-a-palooz ish, with Nourzad at 3.84. I think either the Aiyuk trade or the BTJ in the 1st simplifies things so much!

[bradshaw2ben]

ELITE
no chance anywhere near pick 1.20 or a trade up:
Malik Nabers
Marvin Harrison Jr.
Rome Odunze

EXTREMELY GOOD. Has size/speed/talent to play X and be great WR2 or even WR1
Gone before 51:
Brian Thomas Jr.
Adonai Mitchell
Xavier Legette

REALLY GOOD, JUST LESS HYPED
Javon Baker

REALLY GOOD, BUT TOO SIMILAR TO PICKENS TYPE AND DOESN'T OFFER SPEED
Keon Coleman

LIKE DJ18, NOT AN OUTSIDE GUY BUT YOU COULD USE HIM THAT WAY
Malik Washington

SUPPOSED HEADCASE BUT IF NOT HE'S OKAY
Jermaine Burton

THEORETICALLY AN OUTSIDE WR BUT ALL HE DOES IS CATCH SCREENS AND RUN OVER PEOPLE
Malachi Corley

JOB #1 OF A WR IS TO CATCH THE BALL & IT'S NOT HIS ONLY ISSUE
Devontez Walker


NO WAY-- SLOT GUYS OF VARYING SIZES AND LIMITATIONS
Ladd McConkey
Troy Franklin
Ricky Pearsall
Roman Wilson
Xavier Worthy
Anthony Gould
Ja'Lynn Polk
Jacob Cowing


TAKE A FLYER LATER?
Bub Means
David White, Jr.
Cole Burgess
Ogie-Kellogg
Josh Cephus
Luke McCaffrey
Cornelius Johnson
Ryan Flournoy
Jalen Coker
Casey Washington

I agree with most of this but you lost me at:
NO WAY-- SLOT GUYS OF VARYING SIZES AND LIMITATIONS
Ladd McConkey
Troy Franklin
Ricky Pearsall
Roman Wilson
Xavier Worthy
Anthony Gould
Ja'Lynn Polk
Jacob Cowing

Specifically McConkey and Wilson can play outside and be a #2 WR.

Wilson did NOTHING but run over and seam routes. He has shown no ability to run a route nor beat press coverage. Good luck with McConkey on the outside. He can run routes butm, for a team that's going to run the ball 65% of the time and ask him to block bigger players? oof. I am not a big fan of either player as NFL WRs. They had some great college games but neither is a guy I'm pounding the table for.

[bradshaw2ben]

So safe to say we wouldn’t be unhappy if we went Round 1. Top 4 OT; Round 2. Top 3 C; Round 3. Javon Baker?

I think Baker is good, but BTJ or Legette or especially Aiyuk is super duper. I can be happy with any of them but I can tell you I'd be nervous as hell after BTJ/Legette/Mitchell all gone... worried like hell until Baker made it to my next pick.

@Steelperch The top 6 in receptions for the Falcons under Art Smith were ALL over 220lbs. They drafted big guys, they played big guys, they blocked with big guys, they targeted big guys. Chances are they are going to do as much of that as possible with this 2024 Steelers offense.

[steelclan]

Just listened...

Guyton is a project. I wouldn't touch him at 51 let alone 20.

At the senior bowl he got beat so badly, so often it became almost sad.

Yes, he has good feet and overall athleticism but everything else is a mess.

Anchor is piss poor, punch is pitiful, overextends, ducks his head and struggles with any pass rusher with a modicum of flexibility/speed or power. Darius Robinson made him look silly.

Rest of draft was ok but RB that early? No. Way too many holes on PS roster to be taking a RB in anything but the 6th round or UDFA.

[franco32]

Sometimes we overcomplicate things. I want guys that can run routes, get separation, and have good hands. Ladd or Pearsall can move the chains (something we struggle with of course). Javon is nice but he has concentration and drop issues and lacks top end speed.

Would I rather have BTJ or Xavier or Aiyuk? Sure.

[franco32]

Just listened...

Guyton is a project. I wouldn't touch him at 51 let alone 20.

At the senior bowl he got beat so badly, so often it became almost sad.

Yes, he has good feet and overall athleticism but everything else is a mess.

Anchor is piss poor, punch is pitiful, overextends, ducks his head and struggles with any pass rusher with a modicum of flexibility/speed or power. Darius Robinson made him look silly.

Rest of draft was ok but RB that early? No. Way too many holes on PS roster to be taking a RB in anything but the 6th round or UDFA.

Scares me too. He plays so high he might as well be standing up.