SteelerFury Combined Forum

Time for this.

An old BR report blog from 2010............fitting we're 4 years more in and the draft board reaches have outweighed to ringers. Good or Bad.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/3771 ... d-be-fired

What are the benefits for keeping him?

What are the negatives for keeping him?

What are the positives / negatives if we go in a new direction....who do we try to obtain or promote?

The FO horse pickers do not give me confidence.

BethlehemSteel wrote:Time for this.

An old BR report blog from 2010............fitting we're 4 years more in and the draft board reaches have outweighed to ringers. Good or Bad.

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/3771 ... d-be-fired

What are the benefits for keeping him?

What are the negatives for keeping him?

What are the positives / negatives if we go in a new direction....who do we try to obtain or promote?

The FO horse pickers do not give me confidence.

Poor Mike Tomlin, he's just a poor little Oliver Twist.

That piece blasted him for trading Santonio Holmes.

There is no doubt in my mind that trading Holmes was a mandate from Art Rooney and not Colbert-initiated.

Just like I believe all the stories where Rooney also demanded he trade Ben, and Colbert wisely set the asking price so high that no team would trade for him...delaying things long enough so Rooney would calm down and Colbert could talk sense into him.

Colbert can be blamed for a lot of things, perhaps...trading Santonio is not one of them.

I think Dan was just as responsible for the Santonio trade, if not more so, than Art.

I think the same about the Ben trade rumors, but I don't think they ever intended to trade him -- just scare him straight.

I think Colbert had his worst year ever last year.

But they have said they define the post season as a successful season so I don't see him going anywhere for at least a few years.

He is going to have his hands full because Deebo, Taylor, and Kiesal are as good as gone...Troy sounds like he is coming back...but it's almost ambiguous that it will be here. Taylor might be spent, but the other three were major contributors.

And Thomas and Mitchell suck. The retread DBs are just that. Let's just say Shazier and Tuitt look to be projects.What happens with Woirlds and Allan?

Hell of an off season coming up.

he going to have to do much better in Fa and the draft in 2015

Jeemie wrote:That piece blasted him for trading Santonio Holmes.

There is no doubt in my mind that trading Holmes was a mandate from Art Rooney and not Colbert-initiated.

Just like I believe all the stories where Rooney also demanded he trade Ben, and Colbert wisely set the asking price so high that no team would trade for him...delaying things long enough so Rooney would calm down and Colbert could talk sense into him.

Colbert can be blamed for a lot of things, perhaps...trading Santonio is not one of them.

Im not asking for comment about Trading Santonio.....keep it on topic to my questions..... derailing will only result in your fingers being nuked

Your question is impossible to answer without knowing who has more influence in scouting and deciding on players- Tomlin or Colbert.

He is in my bomb sites. His extensions, his significant draft misses all have set us back at a time when we should be maximizing our chances with a top 5 QB. The clock is ticking and every lost season is one less good shot at #7 for #7. Think of the dead money we will have on our cap next year and what we could do with that, if spent properly.

Just look at the Ravens and their off season moves/drafts over the past 3 years and compare.

Clemson, just curious but why is Deebo as good as gone? Because Lebeau left?

Obviously wrote:Clemson, just curious but why is Deebo as good as gone? Because Lebeau left?

The way Tomlin spoke about him...I am not getting the impression that TOMLIN wants him back.

I think it irked Tomlin that they had to go to the Old Veterans' Home for help again this year.

Now...hopefully...if he has as much say in the players that have been drafted as he says he does...he is channeling any anger he does have towards himself.

Also Harrison and Kiesel and Troy have all spoken in somewhat less than glowing terms of the younger players and them not being "true Steelers". Harrison himself said had it not been for Kiesel being here, he would not have come back.

Obviously wrote:Clemson, just curious but why is Deebo as good as gone? Because Lebeau left?

Yeah, it's my own speculation. The only coach that any of those four often mention is Lebeau...Ike has his thing with Rooney.

From TFFPKs MMQB

6. I think the Dick LeBeau “resignation” is certainly not good news for the future of Troy Polamalu in Pittsburgh. Not that LeBeau could have saved the declining, 34-year-old Polamalu after an invisible season. I don’t see Polamalu back in Pittsburgh.

Man I would rather Troy retire than see him in a different jersey. I always hated seeing Rod Woodson in different jerseys as well, but this would be worse imo.

GreekSteel wrote:From TFFPKs MMQB

6. I think the Dick LeBeau “resignation” is certainly not good news for the future of Troy Polamalu in Pittsburgh. Not that LeBeau could have saved the declining, 34-year-old Polamalu after an invisible season. I don’t see Polamalu back in Pittsburgh.

Man I would rather Troy retire than see him in a different jersey. I always hated seeing Rod Woodson in different jerseys as well, but this would be worse imo.

Agree it would really suck to see Troy in a different uniform. But man, after Woodson left, he played at a very high level at Baltimore and Oakland as a Safety.

Luca Brasi wrote:

GreekSteel wrote:From TFFPKs MMQB

6. I think the Dick LeBeau “resignation” is certainly not good news for the future of Troy Polamalu in Pittsburgh. Not that LeBeau could have saved the declining, 34-year-old Polamalu after an invisible season. I don’t see Polamalu back in Pittsburgh.

Man I would rather Troy retire than see him in a different jersey. I always hated seeing Rod Woodson in different jerseys as well, but this would be worse imo.

Agree it would really suck to see Troy in a different uniform. But man, after Woodson left, he played at a very high level at Baltimore and Oakland as a Safety.

Agreed. Wasn't Woodson in SF also?

Yep, I think he played at SF directly after he left the Steelers. Ugh..was painful

Luca Brasi wrote:

GreekSteel wrote:From TFFPKs MMQB

6. I think the Dick LeBeau “resignation” is certainly not good news for the future of Troy Polamalu in Pittsburgh. Not that LeBeau could have saved the declining, 34-year-old Polamalu after an invisible season. I don’t see Polamalu back in Pittsburgh.

Man I would rather Troy retire than see him in a different jersey. I always hated seeing Rod Woodson in different jerseys as well, but this would be worse imo.

Agree it would really suck to see Troy in a different uniform. But man, after Woodson left, he played at a very high level at Baltimore and Oakland as a Safety.

Yes, there was still meat on the bone with Rod, he had some game left after moving to S. Sadly for Troy, father time always wins.

Rooneys admitted they made a mistake with Rod Woodson.

Jeemie wrote:Rooneys admitted they made a mistake with Rod Woodson.

I still don't understand why they feel that way.

Their contention was that Woodson could no longer play corner in the NFL and needed to move to safety. Woodson disagreed and went to SF to prove he could still play corner at a high level. After a year in SF he was in Baltimore playing safety.

So lets say Kevin Colbert is no longer here, who would be brought in or promoted. Anyone with better inside knowledge.

If they keep him, what does Tomlin and Colbert do to prevent more huge misses?

Point of the thread

USS Steelerworks wrote:

Jeemie wrote:Rooneys admitted they made a mistake with Rod Woodson.

I still don't understand why they feel that way.

Their contention was that Woodson could no longer play corner in the NFL and needed to move to safety. Woodson disagreed and went to SF to prove he could still play corner at a high level. After a year in SF he was in Baltimore playing safety.

Exactly, my recollection was that they wanted to move Rod to safety, and pay him as such. Rod felt he could still play CB and be paid as one. The two sides couldn't come to an agreement and he was off to SF and the rest is history. Seems to me that Rod was the one who wouldn't budge. Regardless, still sucked seeing him in a different uni.

Luca Brasi wrote:

USS Steelerworks wrote:

Jeemie wrote:Rooneys admitted they made a mistake with Rod Woodson.

I still don't understand why they feel that way.

Their contention was that Woodson could no longer play corner in the NFL and needed to move to safety. Woodson disagreed and went to SF to prove he could still play corner at a high level. After a year in SF he was in Baltimore playing safety.

Exactly, my recollection was that they wanted to move Rod to safety, and pay him as such. Rod felt he could still play CB and be paid as one. The two sides couldn't come to an agreement and he was off to SF and the rest is history. Seems to me that Rod was the one who wouldn't budge. Regardless, still sucked seeing him in a different uni.

Cant stand that he won a championship with the Ravens of all teams. Ugh. Painful is right.

BethlehemSteel wrote:So lets say Kevin Colbert is no longer here, who would be brought in or promoted. Anyone with better inside knowledge.

If they keep him, what does Tomlin and Colbert do to prevent more huge misses?

Point of the thread

The grass is always greener...

I think the scouts are failing and need upgraded. Whomever is scouting WR should get a bonus check. LB, less so.

There's no guarantee any new guy will be better.

2010 draft: Pouncey, Worilds, Sanders, Antonio Brown
2011 draft: Heyward, Gilbert, Cortez Allen (?)
2012 draft: DeCastro, Beachum, Spence (?), Adams (?)
2013 draft: Bell, Wheaton, Vince Williams, Shamarko (?), Jarvis Jones (?)
2014 draft: Bryant, Tuitt, Shazier (?), McCullers (?), Blanchflower (?)

There's no bad drafts in that group (maybe 2014 if all the ?'s go bad). 2010 was a great draft. The real problem is they have zero players left from 2008 and 2009 - that should be the veteran heart of a good team. Though the 09 draft had Urbik, Wallace, and Keenan Lewis in it initially. 2008 draft initially got great reviews for the "steals" of Mendenhall and Sweed.

Basically the issue is they completely bombed the drafting and management of two classes in a row... but that was 6 years ago now. There is zero reason to shake things up today after they just improved from 8-8 to 11-5. They need many of those ?'s players (note mostly on defense) to turn into positive contributors and they need to have a good draft this year. But they certainly deserve the chance to try to make it happen.

I should also say that they've done a poor job extending contracts for vet players. No doubt about it. The one that hurt the most today is Woodley, but that was mostly bad luck, it wasn't a bad contract when it was signed. Cortez Allen needs to turn it around or that will be an awful contract.

Hopefully now that the nostaglia of Super Bowl wins has worn off they will not make so many sentimental decisions, but it does bear watching.

Pipes wrote:There's no guarantee any new guy will be better.

2010 draft: Pouncey, Worilds, Sanders, Antonio Brown
2011 draft: Heyward, Gilbert, Cortez Allen (?)
2012 draft: DeCastro, Beachum, Spence (?), Adams (?)
2013 draft: Bell, Wheaton, Vince Williams, Shamarko (?), Jarvis Jones (?)
2014 draft: Bryant, Tuitt, Shazier (?), McCullers (?), Blanchflower (?)

There's no bad drafts in that group (maybe 2014 if all the ?'s go bad). 2010 was a great draft. The real problem is they have zero players left from 2008 and 2009 - that should be the veteran heart of a good team. Though the 09 draft had Urbik, Wallace, and Keenan Lewis in it initially. 2008 draft initially got great reviews for the "steals" of Mendenhall and Sweed.

Basically the issue is they completely bombed the drafting and management of two classes in a row... but that was 6 years ago now. There is zero reason to shake things up today after they just improved from 8-8 to 11-5. They need many of those ?'s players (note mostly on defense) to turn into positive contributors and they need to have a good draft this year. But they certainly deserve the chance to try to make it happen.

Here's why I think a minor shakeup may be a good thing.

2015 is, I think, the point of no return for any of the old vets from the last great Steelers' defense- I think for better or for worse, Troy, Ike, Brett, and james are gone- and then that's it.

So let a "new" guy come in and see what he can do with the new core of players he has.

You're right- there is no guarantee he'll be any better...but now's as good a time as any to find out.

Jeemie wrote:So let a "new" guy come in and see what he can do with the new core of players he has.

You're right- there is no guarantee he'll be any better...but now's as good a time as any to find out.

Change for change sake is never good. If there is a gripe with him then he will be let go but since he is a friend of the Rooneys, I kind of doubt it.

jebrick wrote:

Jeemie wrote:So let a "new" guy come in and see what he can do with the new core of players he has.

You're right- there is no guarantee he'll be any better...but now's as good a time as any to find out.

Change for change sake is never good. If there is a gripe with him then he will be let go but since he is a friend of the Rooneys, I kind of doubt it.

I don't think it was change for change's sake.

I am a firm believer that guys DO get stale after too long in one place. Lebeau has been doing this a LONG time.

This is why I'd rather go outside the organization to find a new DC...I agree with B2B that there is a lot of groupthink going on with the Steelers...I don't see any independent outside perspective informing their thinking at all.

So I think a change is needed- I don't think it's ALL about a lack of talent.

Whether they'll do the change right is another story.

I'm talking about Kevin Colbert, not the DC position.

Who knows about Butler - whether status quo will be good or not, or even how much "status quo" promoting him will mean - but Colbert deserves to continue. There's enough signs of progress on the transition of the roster that a change is not worth the disruption.

Pipes wrote:I'm talking about Kevin Colbert, not the DC position.

Who knows about Butler - whether status quo will be good or not, or even how much "status quo" promoting him will mean - but Colbert deserves to continue. There's enough signs of progress on the transition of the roster that a change is not worth the disruption.

Oh...OK...I misunderstood.

I agree with you there.