Virtual Conventions

[K_C_]

Reading is FUN-DA-MENTAL

You think any federal court or judge is going to rule that federal agents going around in unmarked vehicles and grabbing protestors off the street is illegal?

WTF?



Sure they would.

By your definition, every person who gets detained by police is kidnapped?
Before you answer you should note that there are plenty of unmarked police vehicles and undercover policemen.

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Oh nooooo.......THAT isn't kidnapping.

[955876]

Hey Trump-loving imbeciles, what's your take on this?

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/18/politics ... gfooterold

The only imbecile is you that hasn’t realized after 3 plus years that a lot of what Trump says is tongue n cheek. It’s just off the cuff stuff.

He wasn’t seriously implying he should get a bypass around the constitution and be given a 3rd term.

Stop being triggered so damn easily.

[Donnie Brasco]

You think any federal court or judge is going to rule that federal agents going around in unmarked vehicles and grabbing protestors off the street is illegal?

WTF?



Sure they would.

By your definition, every person who gets detained by police is kidnapped?
Before you answer you should note that there are plenty of unmarked police vehicles and undercover policemen.

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Oh nooooo.......THAT isn't kidnapping.

So is that a yes or a no?

[955876]

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Roger Stone house raided by a dozen armed federal agents in the early morning hours is also like Russia.

They had more officers on that raid then the city of Seattle could muster to protect an entire precinct.

[K_C_]

Hey Trump-loving imbeciles, what's your take on this?

https://www.cnn.com/2020/08/18/politics ... gfooterold

The only imbecile is you that hasn’t realized after 3 plus years that a lot of what Trump says is tongue n cheek. It’s just off the cuff stuff.

He wasn’t seriously implying he should get a bypass around the constitution and be given a 3rd term.

Stop being triggered so damn easily.

No imbecile, if you believe Trump says this shit "off the cuff", you're dumber than Bobo from the Howard Stern show. And that's saying something.

Trump NEVER says divisive shit like this lightly. He's testing the waters with his base. If they buy in, you'll hear it again.

I mean....sometimes you are beyond brainless.

Check this out.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics ... story.html

....and let me remind you, Trump KNOWS what's coming when he walks out of the White House. Fuck, YOU know what's coming for Trump when he leaves the White House....and pssst....it ain't gonna be his face on Mount Rushmore.

[K_C_]

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Roger Stone house raided by a dozen armed federal agents in the early morning hours is also like Russia.

They had more officers on that raid then the city of Seattle could muster to protect an entire precinct.

...and Stone should be in prison right now, so?

[K_C_]

By your definition, every person who gets detained by police is kidnapped?
Before you answer you should note that there are plenty of unmarked police vehicles and undercover policemen.

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Oh nooooo.......THAT isn't kidnapping.

So is that a yes or a no?

Yes, unmarked cars ALWAYS roll up and snatch protestors off the street!!

That's always happened in the ol' USA!!

[COR-TEN]

Wait. A guy who packs a truck full of fertilizer, with the intention of blowing up an entire building - with a school inside to protest government overreach- is the same as a group of agitators squirting lighter fluid into an empty building? Nobody seems to remember the maga bomber, who if successful, would have killed many people. And lets not forget armed far-right extremists seizing and occupying the headquarters of the Malheur National Wildlife Refuge in Harney County, Oregon. For almost 30 days. AR 16 toting demonstrators in front of capital buildings across the country demanding the "economy" is opened is perfectly OK. I guess a 100 heavily armed men is as scary or intimidating as protestors carrying frozen water bottles and home made shields. Does anybody remember the crazy dude driving a car into a crowd, killing a woman then driving off? I never thought every protester was a racist, but the right is calling all protests antifa terrorists. Chanting Jews will not replace us, blacks will not replace us carrying torches isn't terrorism considering the history of violence against blacks? The rhetoric coming from the proud boys isn't terrorism?

The left are fascists, but a president that tells the people that only he can tell you the truth, wants to muzzle the free press, sidesteps the constitution, shuts the government down because he can't get money for his wall is not. Detaining protestors without cause is alright. Got it. I don't think people really know what fascism is.

False equivalencies have infected this country. The ability to see subtlety and nuance is dead, and I know who I would blame for that.

I do not condone the kind of violence that is happening. However, lets not equate the few with the mostly peaceful protesting that has been occurring. I've been to a few, and none were violent. I also firmly believe there are instigators and agitators. And I'll bet some are from the conservative right. Anybody remember the guy dressed in black, with a face mask and a black umbrella smashing windows and walking away? To think there aren't agitators on both sides is naive. The conservative right likes to complain the media is anti right, yet the only thing we see on television is the violence, not the peaceful protests, but nobody is complaining about that because it fits the agenda and narrative that the left/ antifa are all violent thugs.

[K_C_]

Last year, Trump also joked about doing away with term limits in a speech to Republican donors at his Mar-a-Lago estate in which he praised Chinese President Xi Jinping for doing so.

“He’s now president for life. President for life. No, he’s great,” Trump said, according to CNN. “And look, he was able to do that. I think it’s great. Maybe we’ll have to give that a shot some day.”

[Donnie Brasco]

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Oh nooooo.......THAT isn't kidnapping.

So is that a yes or a no?

Yes, unmarked cars ALWAYS roll up and snatch protestors off the street!!

That's always happened in the ol' USA!!

Can you answer yes or no to the following question:
Do you consider it kidnapping when police detain a suspect?

Why can't you answer a simple question? Not that difficult

[K_C_]

So is that a yes or a no?

Yes, unmarked cars ALWAYS roll up and snatch protestors off the street!!

That's always happened in the ol' USA!!

Can you answer yes or no to the following question:
Do you consider it kidnapping when police detain a suspect?

Why can't you answer a simple question? Not that difficult

Do I consider a van rolling up and grabbing a protestor off the street kidnapping?

Um...duh. Yes.

Because it is.

....and it's intentional and part of Trump's "Be Like Putin" mantra towards any kind of protests.

Except of course, when Trump encourages right wingers to protest masks, stay at home laws, etc.

[955876]

Snatched off the street in unmarked vehicles like you're in Russia by secret police?

Roger Stone house raided by a dozen armed federal agents in the early morning hours is also like Russia.

They had more officers on that raid then the city of Seattle could muster to protect an entire precinct.

...and Stone should be in prison right now, so?

I can think of lots of people involved in 2016 that should catch charges for what they did.

[K_C_]

Roger Stone house raided by a dozen armed federal agents in the early morning hours is also like Russia.

They had more officers on that raid then the city of Seattle could muster to protect an entire precinct.

...and Stone should be in prison right now, so?

I can think of lots of people involved in 2016 that should catch charges for what they did.

Agreed but how many of Trump's inner circle have already gone up on charges?

[K_C_]

Roger Stone house raided by a dozen armed federal agents in the early morning hours is also like Russia.

They had more officers on that raid then the city of Seattle could muster to protect an entire precinct.

...and Stone should be in prison right now, so?

I can think of lots of people involved in 2016 that should catch charges for what they did.

https://thehill.com/policy/national-sec ... sia-report

Quite the "Russia Hoax" huh?

[955876]

wants to muzzle the free press, sidesteps the constitution, shuts the government down because he can't get money for his wall is not.

Press should report news not create it.

If you think CNN has been simply “reporting” events these past few years there is no help for you.

Mr. “ I sold my stocks in my 20s becaause they did nothing for me”...

Financially illiterate ideologue is all you really are.

And I prefer a POTUS that will shut things down over a border wall to one that will shut things down over grown men using the little girls room.

[COR-TEN]

Stone's arrest was based on indictments, and at minimum probable cause. He would have destroyed documents, etc. if any were left. And he was found guilty.

Someone walking home after peacefully engaging in a protest is detained without probable cause and that's not a police state?

I know it's hard, but try to see the difference. It's been clearly stated by attorneys consulting with police departments and the feds that the kidnapping of certain people - or at random - is meant to intimidate, not protect and serve. If someone is particularly vocal, they are singled out in order to remove them from the protest, whether they are engaging in a crime or not.

[Donnie Brasco]

Yes, unmarked cars ALWAYS roll up and snatch protestors off the street!!

That's always happened in the ol' USA!!

Can you answer yes or no to the following question:
Do you consider it kidnapping when police detain a suspect?

Why can't you answer a simple question? Not that difficult

Do I consider a van rolling up and grabbing a protestor off the street kidnapping?

Um...duh. Yes.

Because it is.

....and it's intentional and part of Trump's "Be Like Putin" mantra towards any kind of protests.

Except of course, when Trump encourages right wingers to protest masks, stay at home laws, etc.

I didn't ask anything about a van. I'm curious why you can't answer the question as posed.
I asked about detainment by police. The police have the authority to detain any person under suspicion regardless if they ID themselves as an officer or not.

And newsflash, I as a private citizen could have pulled up with my car and made an arrest if I wanted. So is that also kidnapping?

When Can a Private Citizen Arrest Someone?

A person can arrest someone that they reasonably suspect of committing a felony, even if the felony didn't occur in the presence of the individual making the arrest. As long as a felony was actually committed and the individual making the arrest knew of the crime, a reasonable suspicion about the identity of the perpetrator will justify their arrest. However, if the crime did not in fact happen, the person making the arrest could become civilly and criminally liable.

In general, people can't use a citizen's arrest for misdemeanors unless the misdemeanor involves a breach of the peace. Even in these circumstances, however, individuals can only make arrests when they've personally witnessed the criminal behavior and the breach has just occurred or there's a strong likelihood that the breach will continue.

[955876]

Someone walking home after peacefully engaging in a protest is detained without probable cause and that's not a police state?

This is opinion based.

Were you there?

You know what this person was doing leading up to that detainment?

You know there was no probable cause?

Or just going off what they “said”?

[COR-TEN]

Jesus fucking christ, what makes you think i sold the stock?

Weak and lazy arguments when your only goal is to demean and insult through straw men.

I'm doing just fine financially, thanks. I just have a different opinion. But that won't stop you from making shit up.

[955876]

Jesus fucking christ, what makes you think i sold the stock?

Weak and lazy arguments when your only goal is to demean and insult through straw men.

I'm doing just fine financially, thanks. I just have a different opinion. But that won't stop you from making shit up.

Your words made me think that...

I owned stock when I was 26. It was about $2,000. It didn't mean shit.

Owned is a past tense term. When you say I “owned” you are implying you no longer own.

And if you currently owned any, it wouldn’t make sense to comment about when you “owned” some years ago.

So what stock did you own when you were 26?

How old are you now?

A couple simple questions that don’t really reveal anything personally identifying.

Soooo?

[K_C_]

Can you answer yes or no to the following question:
Do you consider it kidnapping when police detain a suspect?

Why can't you answer a simple question? Not that difficult

Do I consider a van rolling up and grabbing a protestor off the street kidnapping?

Um...duh. Yes.

Because it is.

....and it's intentional and part of Trump's "Be Like Putin" mantra towards any kind of protests.

Except of course, when Trump encourages right wingers to protest masks, stay at home laws, etc.

I didn't ask anything about a van. I'm curious why you can't answer the question as posed.
I asked about detainment by police. The police have the authority to detain any person under suspicion regardless if they ID themselves as an officer or not.

And newsflash, I as a private citizen could have pulled up with my car and made an arrest if I wanted. So is that also kidnapping?

When Can a Private Citizen Arrest Someone?

A person can arrest someone that they reasonably suspect of committing a felony, even if the felony didn't occur in the presence of the individual making the arrest. As long as a felony was actually committed and the individual making the arrest knew of the crime, a reasonable suspicion about the identity of the perpetrator will justify their arrest. However, if the crime did not in fact happen, the person making the arrest could become civilly and criminally liable.

In general, people can't use a citizen's arrest for misdemeanors unless the misdemeanor involves a breach of the peace. Even in these circumstances, however, individuals can only make arrests when they've personally witnessed the criminal behavior and the breach has just occurred or there's a strong likelihood that the breach will continue.

Then get out there and make some arrests if you want to.

Make sure to roll up in an unmarked car or van and grab people off the street.

Question 'em and let me know how it goes.

If you don't like the answer, send them to gulag!! Do it the ol' Fat Donnie/Vlad way!

[Donnie Brasco]

Do I consider a van rolling up and grabbing a protestor off the street kidnapping?

Um...duh. Yes.

Because it is.

....and it's intentional and part of Trump's "Be Like Putin" mantra towards any kind of protests.

Except of course, when Trump encourages right wingers to protest masks, stay at home laws, etc.

I didn't ask anything about a van. I'm curious why you can't answer the question as posed.
I asked about detainment by police. The police have the authority to detain any person under suspicion regardless if they ID themselves as an officer or not.

And newsflash, I as a private citizen could have pulled up with my car and made an arrest if I wanted. So is that also kidnapping?

When Can a Private Citizen Arrest Someone?

A person can arrest someone that they reasonably suspect of committing a felony, even if the felony didn't occur in the presence of the individual making the arrest. As long as a felony was actually committed and the individual making the arrest knew of the crime, a reasonable suspicion about the identity of the perpetrator will justify their arrest. However, if the crime did not in fact happen, the person making the arrest could become civilly and criminally liable.

In general, people can't use a citizen's arrest for misdemeanors unless the misdemeanor involves a breach of the peace. Even in these circumstances, however, individuals can only make arrests when they've personally witnessed the criminal behavior and the breach has just occurred or there's a strong likelihood that the breach will continue.

Then get out there and make some arrests if you want to.

Make sure to roll up in an unmarked car or van and grab people off the street.

Question 'em and let me know how it goes.

If you don't like the answer, send them to gulag!! Do it the ol' Fat Donnie/Vlad way!

I don't have to, because the police are handling it in their marked and unmarked vehicles
Glad we agree though that making a citizen's or other detainment arrest isn't kidnapping

[K_C_]

I didn't ask anything about a van. I'm curious why you can't answer the question as posed.
I asked about detainment by police. The police have the authority to detain any person under suspicion regardless if they ID themselves as an officer or not.

And newsflash, I as a private citizen could have pulled up with my car and made an arrest if I wanted. So is that also kidnapping?

Then get out there and make some arrests if you want to.

Make sure to roll up in an unmarked car or van and grab people off the street.

Question 'em and let me know how it goes.

If you don't like the answer, send them to gulag!! Do it the ol' Fat Donnie/Vlad way!

I don't have to, because the police are handling it in their marked and unmarked vehicles
Glad we agree though that making a citizen's or other detainment arrest isn't kidnapping

I'd love to know on average, how many citizens detainments are made per year.

I'll bet it isn't many.

...and what's happening in Portland is definitely kidnapping by Feds.

[955876]

The feds should step up that kidnapping. Get some of those punks off the street.

Or better yet, just let it be known vigilante justice will be prosecuted with the same intensity (lack thereof) as those committing assault, theft, vandalism, arson, and destruction of property while “peacefully protesting”.

[Donnie Brasco]

Then get out there and make some arrests if you want to.

Make sure to roll up in an unmarked car or van and grab people off the street.

Question 'em and let me know how it goes.

If you don't like the answer, send them to gulag!! Do it the ol' Fat Donnie/Vlad way!

I don't have to, because the police are handling it in their marked and unmarked vehicles
Glad we agree though that making a citizen's or other detainment arrest isn't kidnapping

I'd love to know on average, how many citizens detainments are made per year.

I'll bet it isn't many.

...and what's happening in Portland is definitely kidnapping by Feds.

I've just outlined why it isn't. I haven't seen any data or statutes to PROVE otherwise. No one else has either (unless I missed the inks that are hard to see on this page)
You may have FEELINGS and THOUGHTS and OPINIONS and perhaps MORALES why it is, but that doesn't carry much weight in the justice system does it?

And I've googled, nothing readily apparent regarding the number of citizen arrests. Doubtful that ANY PD delineates because once the cops show up their charges supersede anything else.

Be an interesting data point for sure

[K_C_]

I don't have to, because the police are handling it in their marked and unmarked vehicles
Glad we agree though that making a citizen's or other detainment arrest isn't kidnapping

I'd love to know on average, how many citizens detainments are made per year.

I'll bet it isn't many.

...and what's happening in Portland is definitely kidnapping by Feds.

I've just outlined why it isn't. I haven't seen any data or statutes to PROVE otherwise. No one else has either (unless I missed the inks that are hard to see on this page)
You may have FEELINGS and THOUGHTS and OPINIONS and perhaps MORALES why it is, but that doesn't carry much weight in the justice system does it?

And I've googled, nothing readily apparent regarding the number of citizen arrests. Doubtful that ANY PD delineates because once the cops show up their charges supersede anything else.

Be an interesting data point for sure

Federal courts aren't going to rule Federal Agents grabbing people off the streets into unmarked cars illegal. They could be waterboarding them or using a rubber hose and it isn't going to happen under Trump.

Trump's dream is to rule like Putin. That's why he doesn't have any cute names for Vlad, like he does for everybody else and he has praised Putin so ridiculously, Fat Donnie's own party was sickened by it.

It is what it is.

[COR-TEN]

Any arrest or "detainment" without probably cause for a misdemeanor would be thrown out of court before the gavel hits. But many conservatives see law enforcement as judge, jury, and executioner. They should be obeyed like they are the masters, and nothing can impede their authority. They tell you to jump, you're supposed to ask how high. Because you know, laws. The thin blue line, loyalty to policing and not the truth, or justice. They want to control and occupy instead of protect and serve. This is just a symptom of a police state.

It's exactly why cops always use the phrase "I felt threatened." It ipso facto makes them untouchable. So all a cop has to say is "I saw him throw a brick." Whether they threw a brick or not is irrelevant. That's the very definition of totalitarianism.

Detain without cause is kidnapping.

[955876]

Whether they threw a brick or not is irrelevant. That's the very definition of totalitarianism.

Ummmm if they did throw a brick how is that irrelevant?

Your view of the world exist with this implicit bias that all cops lie. All cops are minions of Trump. And all wanna be thug anarchist are but peaceful protestors being victimized by the gestapo.

Please.

Now go back a few post and answer some of those questions. Or will you weasel out of it?

[COR-TEN]

So if I refuse to engage, and play by your rules, I'm weaseling out of it?

Fuck off, you idiot. I prefer not to entertain stupidity.

[955876]

You asked why I thought you sold your stock.

I posted why. You said you “owned” as in past tense and did so while trying to make a point that stocks don’t benefit most people.

So in trying to make that point you said “I owned stock when I was 26, was $2k, didn’t mean shit”.

That implies you sold it.

Also implies you own none now. Because if you did, you could use some thing present time as an example rather than reach all the way back to when you were 26.

Face it, you got caught looking a bit silly and now wanna move on.

And you know from past experience I’ll badger you about it so might as well hash it out now.

Or else it’ll just follow you.