Door Opener Award

[Stosh-67]

Sure. Top 10 all time.
Right there.
Most accurate kicker from 50+ coming into this season...
And he just stomped an exclamation point on top of that.

[Obviously]

Steelers win. Kudos.

Not a dumber coach in the league than Mike Tomlin

Scariest aspect? Possible dumbest HOF HC to be ever enshrined. If it happens.

Oh, Tomlin to the HoF is a stone cold lock.
Fun fact…he’s never had a losing season! Most don’t know that…

Except for the postseason. 8-10.

[zeke5123]

Sure. Top 10 all time.
Right there.
Most accurate kicker from 50+ coming into this season...
And he just stomped an exclamation point on top of that.

Yeah. I’m just saying there clearly isn’t a better other Steeler kicker let alone maybe four of them. Boz is the best kicker in Steelers history and will keep ascending the all time ranks.

[Stosh-67]

Boswell and Gary Anderson.
.
.
.
Jeff Reed
Sean Suisham.
.
. Matt Bahr

[stillthere]

Boswell and Gary Anderson.
.
.
.
Jeff Reed
Sean Suisham.
.
. Matt Bahr

Norm Johnson for the surprise onside in XXX

[VeritasSteel]

You guys crack me up.

Steelers up until that point were dog walking the Falcons on that drive. It was 4th and less than one and they rushed the play instead of taking their time. Good call poor execution.

A FG doesn’t end the game there. TD and 2 point conversion is still a one score game. Going for the kill there was the correct call to take everything off the defense. They get the first there at worst Falcons get the ball back with no TOs and less than 10 seconds.

Yes. If the Falcons score a TD and get a two pointer you are tied. Being up 8 late with a good defense is a good spot.

The flip side is picking up the first down doesn’t guarantee a TD.

I’d go for it every time probably until early fourth Q. But when Tomlin decided to go for it he was reckless.

It is classic Tomlin. Super conservative when he should be aggressive and super aggressive when he should be conservative.

In this day and age you need to take those kill shots when you have the opportunity. People keep talking about “the math” and not mentioning implied odds, potential expected outcomes and defeated strategies. Taking FG to extend the game is how Buffalo or Cincinnati or Houston ended up losing against Kansas City. You can not extend a game when you’re getting good odds and positive expected outcomes to end it.

The 6 things that could have happened down there are

We score the FG then give the ball back to Atlanta on the 30 with 3 TOs and have to play both run and pass.

We miss the FG and they have the ball on the 10

We fail on the 4th down and give it to them on the 3 and force Atlanta to score a touchdown on a defense they only had 60 yards against in the second half. Which is what happened.

We get the first we spend the next 3 plays getting them to burn their TOs and then kick the FG

We get the first and score

We turn the ball over and they get a huge return or score

In that situation you got more positives and you’re hedging on the impact of the negatives.


If we’re up 6 - FG.
If it puts us up 4 - FG

For all the bed wetting of the offense style it accomplished a 15 play 7 minute drive in the fourth and rested a defense that played the last two drives like they were the first two. If Tomlin is in the same position against better teams he makes the same call.

.

[.Kodiak]

Pickens made some sick grabs and was giving a lot of effort out there.

I'm guessing 6 catches for 85 yards and 0 TDs isn't going to cut it. Those are fairly average numbers vs. what Pickens would like to be putting up.

[swissvale72]

Boswell and Gary Anderson.
.
.
.
Jeff Reed
Sean Suisham.
.
. Matt Bahr

Norm Johnson for the surprise onside in XXX

Nope....norm misses a 37 yarder first possession of 97 AFCCG. Steelers lose by 3

[swissvale72]

You guys crack me up.

Steelers up until that point were dog walking the Falcons on that drive. It was 4th and less than one and they rushed the play instead of taking their time. Good call poor execution.

A FG doesn’t end the game there. TD and 2 point conversion is still a one score game. Going for the kill there was the correct call to take everything off the defense. They get the first there at worst Falcons get the ball back with no TOs and less than 10 seconds.

Yes. If the Falcons score a TD and get a two pointer you are tied. Being up 8 late with a good defense is a good spot.

The flip side is picking up the first down doesn’t guarantee a TD.

I’d go for it every time probably until early fourth Q. But when Tomlin decided to go for it he was reckless.

It is classic Tomlin. Super conservative when he should be aggressive and super aggressive when he should be conservative.

In this day and age you need to take those kill shots when you have the opportunity. People keep talking about “the math” and not mentioning implied odds, potential expected outcomes and defeated strategies. Taking FG to extend the game is how Buffalo or Cincinnati or Houston ended up losing against Kansas City. You can not extend a game when you’re getting good odds and positive expected outcomes to end it.

The 6 things that could have happened down there are

We score the FG then give the ball back to Atlanta on the 30 with 3 TOs and have to play both run and pass.

We miss the FG and they have the ball on the 10

We fail on the 4th down and give it to them on the 3 and force Atlanta to score a touchdown on a defense they only had 60 yards against in the second half. Which is what happened.

We get the first we spend the next 3 plays getting them to burn their TOs and then kick the FG

We get the first and score

We turn the ball over and they get a huge return or score

In that situation you got more positives and you’re hedging on the impact of the negatives.


If we’re up 6 - FG.
If it puts us up 4 - FG

For all the bed wetting of the offense style it accomplished a 15 play 7 minute drive in the fourth and rested a defense that played the last two drives like they were the first two. If Tomlin is in the same position against better teams he makes the same call.

.
[/quote)

Simply put...and fwiw...I was good with the decision. Fields had picked up the first down on two previous sneaks. Also....up to me, im playing fields next week. He improved as the game went on

[955876]

You guys crack me up.

Steelers up until that point were dog walking the Falcons on that drive. It was 4th and less than one and they rushed the play instead of taking their time. Good call poor execution.

A FG doesn’t end the game there. TD and 2 point conversion is still a one score game. Going for the kill there was the correct call to take everything off the defense. They get the first there at worst Falcons get the ball back with no TOs and less than 10 seconds.

Yes. If the Falcons score a TD and get a two pointer you are tied. Being up 8 late with a good defense is a good spot.

The flip side is picking up the first down doesn’t guarantee a TD.

I’d go for it every time probably until early fourth Q. But when Tomlin decided to go for it he was reckless.

It is classic Tomlin. Super conservative when he should be aggressive and super aggressive when he should be conservative.

Totally agree with this and was just going to post something similiar. That sequence was a microcosm of Tomlin’s poor in game management year end and year out.

In that spot, with a bad offense, going up 8 late in the 4th quarter was a no brainer. At worst the Falcons could only tie the game and depending on how long it took them to do so leaves us with either a little time to get in to FG range as the game winds down or puts us in OT.

Going for it and not making it opened the door where they could have slammed the door on us with a TD.

Ben Roethlisberger isn’t on the team anymore. Rabbits don’t get pulled out of hats. Need to play the percentages there.

[955876]

Boswell and Gary Anderson.
.
.
.
Jeff Reed
Sean Suisham.
.
. Matt Bahr

Norm Johnson for the surprise onside in XXX

Nope....norm misses a 37 yarder first possession of 97 AFCCG. Steelers lose by 3

Your ability to recall details and moments from Steelers history is unparalleled.

Do you look this shit up or pull it off the top of your head?

[955876]

Mike Tomlin

There are quite a few reasons but we will stick with not kicking the FG to go up 8 late.

FG makes it a 1 score game. TD wins it. I get the call, play call was stupid.

I liked going for it but what was the rush?

Any hard count there likely gets you a free 5 yards and a first down.

Even the announcers were wondering why the Steelers were in such a rush. Absolutely looked like they never practiced for that situation. No nuance no situational understanding or composure.

That’s on Tomlin.

Almost as bad as him rushing Boswell out onto a sloppy field Oakland to attempt a kick as time expired all the while having a time out in his back pocket.

Maybe the Mrs. treats him to a hummer if he comes home from road games with an unused time out.

[swissvale72]

Norm Johnson for the surprise onside in XXX

Nope....norm misses a 37 yarder first possession of 97 AFCCG. Steelers lose by 3

Your ability to recall details and moments from Steelers history is unparalleled.

Do you look this shit up or pull it off the top of your head?

Seared into my memory 95, that particular steeler loss more than some others. I was sitting in the TRS stands, first row in the upper end zone and these were the indelible events that unfolded in front of me...the Chan fuckin gailey game.

Steelers lead, 14-10, less than 4 min to half, facing 2nd & 1 at the Denver 34 or so. Bettis running well, as is kordell, who had nearly been picked twice. Instead of running for the first down, exhausting the clock, going into half with a probable 7 point lead anyway, against the elway broncos, Chan fuckin gailey has kordell throw deep, this time into double coverage. This time it IS picked. A couple DPI calls later and a rate yancey thigpen drop and Steelers trail at half, 24-14....a magical season ends. Arghhh!!! Chan fuckin gailey.

[Stlcrtn1974]

Nope....norm misses a 37 yarder first possession of 97 AFCCG. Steelers lose by 3

Your ability to recall details and moments from Steelers history is unparalleled.

Do you look this shit up or pull it off the top of your head?

Seared into my memory 95, that particular steeler loss more than some others. I was sitting in the TRS stands, first row in the upper end zone and these were the indelible events that unfolded in front of me...the Chan fuckin gailey game.

Steelers lead, 14-10, less than 4 min to half, facing 2nd & 1 at the Denver 34 or so. Bettis running well, as is kordell, who had nearly been picked twice. Instead of running for the first down, exhausting the clock, going into half with a probable 7 point lead anyway, against the elway broncos, Chan fuckin gailey has kordell throw deep, this time into double coverage. This time it IS picked. A couple DPI calls later and a rate yancey thigpen drop and Steelers trail at half, 24-14....a magical season ends. Arghhh!!! Chan fuckin gailey.

I blame Korky more then Gailey, if it's not there you don't throw into double coverage. Stewart could not handle the pressure of playoff football, he blew it in 97 and he sucked it in 01.

[zeke5123]

You guys crack me up.

Steelers up until that point were dog walking the Falcons on that drive. It was 4th and less than one and they rushed the play instead of taking their time. Good call poor execution.

A FG doesn’t end the game there. TD and 2 point conversion is still a one score game. Going for the kill there was the correct call to take everything off the defense. They get the first there at worst Falcons get the ball back with no TOs and less than 10 seconds.

Yes. If the Falcons score a TD and get a two pointer you are tied. Being up 8 late with a good defense is a good spot.

The flip side is picking up the first down doesn’t guarantee a TD.

I’d go for it every time probably until early fourth Q. But when Tomlin decided to go for it he was reckless.

It is classic Tomlin. Super conservative when he should be aggressive and super aggressive when he should be conservative.

In this day and age you need to take those kill shots when you have the opportunity. People keep talking about “the math” and not mentioning implied odds, potential expected outcomes and defeated strategies. Taking FG to extend the game is how Buffalo or Cincinnati or Houston ended up losing against Kansas City. You can not extend a game when you’re getting good odds and positive expected outcomes to end it.

The 6 things that could have happened down there are

We score the FG then give the ball back to Atlanta on the 30 with 3 TOs and have to play both run and pass.

We miss the FG and they have the ball on the 10

We fail on the 4th down and give it to them on the 3 and force Atlanta to score a touchdown on a defense they only had 60 yards against in the second half. Which is what happened.

We get the first we spend the next 3 plays getting them to burn their TOs and then kick the FG

We get the first and score

We turn the ball over and they get a huge return or score

In that situation you got more positives and you’re hedging on the impact of the negatives.


If we’re up 6 - FG.
If it puts us up 4 - FG

For all the bed wetting of the offense style it accomplished a 15 play 7 minute drive in the fourth and rested a defense that played the last two drives like they were the first two. If Tomlin is in the same position against better teams he makes the same call.

.

All of your “six things” ignore score impact. At that point in the game getting it to 8 was very important.

[swissvale72]

Your ability to recall details and moments from Steelers history is unparalleled.

Do you look this shit up or pull it off the top of your head?

Seared into my memory 95, that particular steeler loss more than some others. I was sitting in the TRS stands, first row in the upper end zone and these were the indelible events that unfolded in front of me...the Chan fuckin gailey game.

Steelers lead, 14-10, less than 4 min to half, facing 2nd & 1 at the Denver 34 or so. Bettis running well, as is kordell, who had nearly been picked twice. Instead of running for the first down, exhausting the clock, going into half with a probable 7 point lead anyway, against the elway broncos, Chan fuckin gailey has kordell throw deep, this time into double coverage. This time it IS picked. A couple DPI calls later and a rate yancey thigpen drop and Steelers trail at half, 24-14....a magical season ends. Arghhh!!! Chan fuckin gailey.

I blame Korky more then Gailey, if it's not there you don't throw into double coverage. Stewart could not handle the pressure of playoff football, he blew it in 97 and he sucked it in 01.

I guess my point is that he had already been making poor decisions that game, so run the ball, pick up the first down, exhaust the clock, prob go in up 7 at halftime and getting the ball to start the second half.

[Deebo]

Boswell and Gary Anderson.
.
.
.
Jeff Reed
Sean Suisham.
.
. Matt Bahr

Norm Johnson for the surprise onside in XXX

Nope....norm misses a 37 yarder first possession of 97 AFCCG. Steelers lose by 3

Was just about to post this very thing. That was a HUUUUGE miss. Sunk the Steelers' momentum early

[Jobu]

Stewart could not handle the pressure of playoff football, he blew it in 97 and he sucked it in 01.

Mentally weak.

[stillthere]

A 13-play, 72-yard drive in the fourth should have been the final demoralizing fate for the Falcons instead it became a breath of life because they were one fluke play away from being in the lead (with some freak athletes in their skill position rooms).

[stillthere]

“Just, we’re going to live that life. We don’t live in our fears,” Tomlin said. “We play, and we play to win. If you can’t get 4th-and-1, sometimes you don’t deserve to win. That’s just a philosophical approach that we live by.”

If you are losing late in a game and you don't convert on 4th and 1 you may deserve to lose. If you are up by 5 and decide to go for it inside the 20 instead of making the hill Atlanta had to overcome near impossible then you are a moron.

[VeritasSteel]

All of your “six things” ignore score impact. At that point in the game getting it to 8 was very important.

I said if we were up 6 or if the field goal makes it 4 or greater then the FG would have been the correct call.

What’s more important extending the game or ending it if you have the chance? IMO if you’re playing this bully style football you have to take every opportunity to end games when the chance is presented to you.

In this case Tomlin was working with a stacked deck in his favor- we had a lead that could only be overcome with a TD, defense was playing lights out and well rested, a 6’5” QB that needs 6 inches to effectively end the game, and a Falcons defense was on skates that entire drive. Steelers take their time and do a hard count the game or have their linemen set- we aren’t talking about the “horrible game management” and whatever else.

The other side of that is you are facing a veteran QB with weapons in the two minute drill with all his timeouts- I would rather him start at the 3 rather than the 30.

How comfortable would you feel if the opponent is Kansas City, Miami (at home), or Buffalo with an 8 point lead and over 4 minutes left and they have all their TOs? In those cases 8 is as good as 5.

[stillthere]

How comfortable would you feel if the opponent is Kansas City, Miami (at home), or Buffalo with an 8 point lead and over 4 minutes left and they have all their TOs? In those cases 8 is as good as 5.

We were not playing KC, Mia or Buf we were in Atlanta with a chance to essentially ice the game away.

I would also rather have an 8 point lead with 4 minutes to go against all those teams over a 5 point lead with the same amount of time.

[Deebo]

How comfortable would you feel if the opponent is Kansas City, Miami (at home), or Buffalo with an 8 point lead and over 4 minutes left and they have all their TOs? In those cases 8 is as good as 5.

We were not playing KC, Mia or Buf we were in Atlanta with a chance to essentially ice the game away.

I would also rather have an 8 point lead with 4 minutes to go against all those teams over a 5 point lead with the same amount of time.

You can still support the decision to go for it, but rightfully criticize the play/execution of it.

Going for it was the right choice as 3 outcomes are possible:

1. You get it and extend the drive (therefore reducing the amount of time Atl has to work with). Effectively icing the game.
2. You get it and subsequently get a TD, again icing the game.
3. You get stopped but at least Atl has a longer field

Option 4 was kicking the FG, but it's still a 1 score game and I do not trust our KO team to not give up great field position.

[zeke5123]

How comfortable would you feel if the opponent is Kansas City, Miami (at home), or Buffalo with an 8 point lead and over 4 minutes left and they have all their TOs? In those cases 8 is as good as 5.

We were not playing KC, Mia or Buf we were in Atlanta with a chance to essentially ice the game away.

I would also rather have an 8 point lead with 4 minutes to go against all those teams over a 5 point lead with the same amount of time.

You can still support the decision to go for it, but rightfully criticize the play/execution of it.

Going for it was the right choice as 3 outcomes are possible:

1. You get it and extend the drive (therefore reducing the amount of time Atl has to work with). Effectively icing the game.
2. You get it and subsequently get a TD, again icing the game.
3. You get stopped but at least Atl has a longer field

Option 4 was kicking the FG, but it's still a 1 score game and I do not trust our KO team to not give up great field position.

You kick it out of the back of the EZ. Take KO team issue out of play.

If you go up 8, then it basically plays out that Atlanta will have one change to get a TD + 2 point conversion. So whatever odds are that Atlanta scores, you need to multiply that by roughly 50%. The odds there are quite low. So if that happens, you win. There would probably be about 45 seconds to 90 seconds left and the Steelers likely would have a time out or two. So even in the case where they score and get a two point conversion, there is a chance to get 25 yards to give Boz a really long chance to win the game in regulation. Then OT is a coin flip.

When you multiply out those odds it is probably something like 93% chance of winning by kicking the FG (odds of losing need 35% chance of Atlanta scoring a TD * 50% two point * 85% Steelers don't get a last second Steelers FG * 50% OT).

If you go for it and succeed, then your odds of winning go up. If all that happens is four runs (e.g., the fourth down pick up + three stuffed runs) then you end up taking the clock down to the 2 minute warning and going up 8. Also if you get a TD there, then you win. Of course, the other outcome is that the Steelers go for it again on fourth down and fail. But lets ignore that.

The downside is that if you don't get the fourth down, then a TD puts you behind by 1 or 3 (Atlanta would go for a two pointer). So now you would need your offense to with relatively little time get in range for a long Boz FG attempt. If Atlanta scores a TD (call it 30%), I think there is probably about a 5% chance of the Steelers winning in that case (if down three FG only gets them to OT and probably less time on the clock). You pick up that 4th down probably 80% of the time. So the expected cost of failure is about 5.7%. The steady state was already 93%.

You can play with the weights but it really is hard to justify the decision (at best it comes out to almost neutral).

[VeritasSteel]

How comfortable would you feel if the opponent is Kansas City, Miami (at home), or Buffalo with an 8 point lead and over 4 minutes left and they have all their TOs? In those cases 8 is as good as 5.

We were not playing KC, Mia or Buf we were in Atlanta with a chance to essentially ice the game away.

I would also rather have an 8 point lead with 4 minutes to go against all those teams over a 5 point lead with the same amount of time.

5 is the same thing as 8, the Falcons had to drive the field and score a TD and a 2 point conversion. Because if it’s a five point lead scoring 7 just gives them a 2 point lead. Thats no good where the opposing kicker has drilled a 57 yarder and flexing on you by hitting good punts.

I like our defense but if the difference between two scores and one is 6 inches late in a game- I am trying to convert that 6 inches. Who we are playing is not the point- ending the game there was. Cousins has been the QB on 3 of the biggest comebacks of all time- two against the Saints and the Bills so respecting that you have to try to end the game.

Atlanta needed a TD and conversion regardless. So I would rather them start at the 3 rather than the 30 to get it. Especially when they are going against a rested defense that has pitched a shutout after the 3 drive.

[zeke5123]

How comfortable would you feel if the opponent is Kansas City, Miami (at home), or Buffalo with an 8 point lead and over 4 minutes left and they have all their TOs? In those cases 8 is as good as 5.

We were not playing KC, Mia or Buf we were in Atlanta with a chance to essentially ice the game away.

I would also rather have an 8 point lead with 4 minutes to go against all those teams over a 5 point lead with the same amount of time.

5 is the same thing as 8, the Falcons had to drive the field and score a TD and a 2 point conversion. Because if it’s a five point lead scoring 7 just gives them a 2 point lead. Thats no good where the opposing kicker has drilled a 57 yarder and flexing on you by hitting good punts.

I like our defense but I am if the difference between two scores and one is 6 inches late in a game- I am trying to convert that 6 inches. Who we are playing is not the point- ending the game there was. Cousins has been the QB on 3 of the biggest comebacks of all time- two against the Saints and the Bills so respecting that you have to try to end the game.

Atlanta needed a TD and conversion regardless. So I would rather them start at the 3 rather than the 30 to get it. Especially when they are going against a rested defense that has pitched a shutout after the 3 drive.

8 point lead means the other team HAS to get the two pointer. 5 point lead means if the other team doesn't get the two pointer YOU need to get in FG range to win.

[VeritasSteel]

If they were a threat to go the length of the field and score a TD and a two point doesn’t make closing out the game when you have the chance even more necessary?

With any score line the Falcons other than them being down by 7 they need a TD and 2 point conversion. So why not try to end the game or at worst put them in adverse field position. Then they have to be conservative while we get them in 3rd and long and speed up his throws- which is what happened.

Now the series afterwards play calling was predictable and horrendous. But thats where a vet sees the run blitz and gets us out of it on some simple play to the TE that goes for 5 or 50.

[Jizz Mop]

Kick the FG to go up 8

No brainer

Mike Tomlin is and always will be a dunce

I like our chances up 8 w 4 mins left the way the D had been playing

Idiotic dumbfuck is Tomlin

[stillthere]

5 is the same thing as 8

????????????????????????????????????????????
with a 5 point lead ATL would need a TD and no XP (one or two point) to be winning.
with an 8 point lead they have to get into the endzone on 2 consecutive plays.

Which seems harder?

[swissvale72]

5 is the same thing as 8

????????????????????????????????????????????
with a 5 point lead ATL would need a TD and no XP (one or two point) to be winning.
with an 8 point lead they have to get into the endzone on 2 consecutive plays.

Which seems harder?

It's fair to say that I've been a fairly steady Tomlin critic for the past decade. In this instance though, I'm with Veritas, even though he and I will never agree about santonio Holmes. In fact I'll go one better.

I was good with going for it. Make it and game is over. Don't make it and falcons have to drive 90+ yards rather than 70. I'm placing the priority on preventing an atlanta touchdown

I also, with a new holder gone for it inside the 10 with 31 seconds remaining....same reasoning. Let them try to go 90 yards in that time frame with no timeouts

Starting on the 30 they had a decent chance of an eventual Hail Mary attempt into the endzone e