That suit....Jesus....
Art II speaks...all but shoves AB out the door
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Havoc, one other stat that has been bothering me the past couple seasons with Brown is that he really has a lower first down percentage than other WRs. What does that mean? Well, how many of his catches are going for first downs?? Moving the chains, etc.
I look around and see that many of the great WRs, many of the very good WRs all have first down percentages in the 70s, even 80%.
Mike Evans and Kenny Golladay were at 80%.
The Rams Robert Woods as at 77%
Alston Jeffrey and Amari Cooper were at 74%
Julio Jones and Hopkins and Tyler Boyd, Brandin Cooks they were all between 70-72%
Where was Antonion Brown on this list for first down percentage??
Brown was all the way down at 60.6%
So, Ben was completing 61.9% of his passing attempts to Brown and only 60.6% of those passes resulted in first downs. And then look at all of the INTs that Ben threw trying to fit passes into Brown. How many INTs? 7,8? That is a special connection, really??
There are a lot of QB/WR combos out there where they are completing 70-75% of their passes and those completed passes are going for first downs 70% of the time and yet the Ben to Brown connection is special??
I look around and see that many of the great WRs, many of the very good WRs all have first down percentages in the 70s, even 80%.
Mike Evans and Kenny Golladay were at 80%.
The Rams Robert Woods as at 77%
Alston Jeffrey and Amari Cooper were at 74%
Julio Jones and Hopkins and Tyler Boyd, Brandin Cooks they were all between 70-72%
Where was Antonion Brown on this list for first down percentage??
Brown was all the way down at 60.6%
So, Ben was completing 61.9% of his passing attempts to Brown and only 60.6% of those passes resulted in first downs. And then look at all of the INTs that Ben threw trying to fit passes into Brown. How many INTs? 7,8? That is a special connection, really??
There are a lot of QB/WR combos out there where they are completing 70-75% of their passes and those completed passes are going for first downs 70% of the time and yet the Ben to Brown connection is special??
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Orangesteel
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Still Lit wrote:
That suit....Jesus....
I dig the suit. It has a Von Dutch/Ed Hardy look to it.
“Thoughts are a waste of time for me.” - Michael Pettaway Tomlin
swissvale72 wrote:Steelers are a MUCH worse team without Antonio Brown. It's that fuckin' simple.
I don't think we know that for sure. If you're using the Bungles game as evidence, much of the offensive turmoil was BECAUSE OF Antonio Brown.
Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile...
Damn I hate this passive aggressive "protect my ego" shit.
That's Antonio letting Art II know the message was received and understood (although it DOESN'T mean AB is gonna behave himself if given another chance).
“Yeah we suck, be there is a chance we could suck slightly more if we try to correct the problem.” - Art Deuce (summarized by SteelPerch)
Ice wrote:swissvale72 wrote:Steelers are a MUCH worse team without Antonio Brown. It's that fuckin' simple.
I don't think we know that for sure. If you're using the Bungles game as evidence, much of the offensive turmoil was BECAUSE OF Antonio Brown.
If I trusted Mike Tomlin to oversee the rebuild, I'd be much more inclined to take the risk of letting AB go.
“Yeah we suck, be there is a chance we could suck slightly more if we try to correct the problem.” - Art Deuce (summarized by SteelPerch)
bradshaw2ben wrote:GreekSteel wrote:bradshaw2ben wrote:Aditi is right about one thing: AB and Ben are a match made in heaven on the field. Drew Rosenhaus knows this, Ben knows this, AB sure as shit knows this, Rooney knows this, Tomlin knows this, Colbert knows this. Everybody knows this.
Leaving is a no-win situation for anybody. If the Cards offer you Pat Peterson and the #1 pick, I guess you'd take the deal but nobody is going to end up happy except for maybe Peterson.
As much as i dont want AB to leave, JujU would become the new shiny toy. Its all about Ben when it comes to his Wrs.
JuJu is a much better #2 than a #1. Great player but I'd be concerned about heading into a season with JuJu, Washington, Rogers, & Switzer as your top 4.
Yeah, because the Steelers wouldn't draft another receiver high to add to that group (and probably sign a vet to strengthen the receiving corps even more).
C'mon.
It needs to be said, again, that if AB is to return to the Steelers, they need to have a come to Jesus talk with him.
Not about him going AWOL. Nope. The talk needs to be about his selfishness on the field, on the sidelines, in the locker room, on social media, you name it.
Ben threw several of his INT's trying to force balls to an often BLANKETED Antonio Brown. Watch the last play of the Denver game if you don't believe me.
No question Ben forced balls to AB to shut him the fuck up. To make him happy. To keep him from being a distraction. If AB is going to continue to be a distraction, the Steelers NO DOUBT are better off without him.
Last edited by dspotz43 on Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:56 am, edited 1 time in total.
"...It's very difficult to keep the line between the past and the present... Do you know what I mean...?"
Edith 'Little Edie' Bouvier Beale
Edith 'Little Edie' Bouvier Beale
I still think there is a money aspect to this as well.
Brown is probably upset that he is making so much less money then other WRs.
Don't give me that per season crap, all Brown is looking at is that OBJ signed for $95 million, or that Evans signed for $82 million, or that cooks signed for $80 million, meanwhile poor Antonio had to settle for $68!!
I bet this is a ploy to get more money out of the Steelers and if traded to get more money out of his new team too.
I think any trade will be contingent upon Brown getting paid more, getting a new contract.
Brown is probably upset that he is making so much less money then other WRs.
Don't give me that per season crap, all Brown is looking at is that OBJ signed for $95 million, or that Evans signed for $82 million, or that cooks signed for $80 million, meanwhile poor Antonio had to settle for $68!!
I bet this is a ploy to get more money out of the Steelers and if traded to get more money out of his new team too.
I think any trade will be contingent upon Brown getting paid more, getting a new contract.
swissvale72 wrote:Steelers are a MUCH worse team without Antonio Brown. It's that fuckin' simple.
Not the Antonio Brown ignoring his coaches and teammates. Not the ego driven Antonio Brown who is constantly bitching to Roethlisberger about his targets and how they aren't enough.
Not the AB that was ALMOST CERTAINLY jealous as fuck about Juju winning team MVP. Not the Antonio Brown who has become more about Antonio Brown being marketed than winning football games.
If we trade AB for a nice haul, I'll bet you see Ben have an outstanding year and we return to the playoffs.
Why? No more forcing throws to a blanketed AB and much more spreading it around.
The AB we currently have....well, I'm not at all surprised this team is dysfunctional as fuck.
Tomlin, as much as I loathe the piece of shit, is still our coach. He needs to take back FULL CONTROL of this team and if that means jettisoning AB and his massive ego, I'm ALL FOR IT.
"...It's very difficult to keep the line between the past and the present... Do you know what I mean...?"
Edith 'Little Edie' Bouvier Beale
Edith 'Little Edie' Bouvier Beale
jebrick wrote:VanWilder wrote:Am I the only one that thought Brown lost a half step this year? You could normally rely on his ability to make the first guy miss. He appeared to go down when in space fairly quickly. I'm curious to see his YAC this year compared with previous seasons.
Brown has almost always been neutralized by double coverage. If his quickness does not get him open, he does not have the physical toolset to "get the ball" like Julio Jones.
Ben needed to learn not to keep forcing the ball to AB. I'll bet 1/2 of Ben's INTs were forcing the ball to Brown.
Agree with all of that. If his quickness is declining, I'd be inclined to move him while he has value.
And Swiss, I wouldn't be suggesting a trade if the return wasn't great. 2014-2016 Brown is untradeable. This version is a distraction with declining skills.
Last edited by Ice on Fri Jan 11, 2019 12:59 am, edited 1 time in total.
Orangesteel wrote:They better not fuck this up.
That’s my concern
Suwanee88 wrote:Orangesteel wrote:They better not fuck this up.
That’s my concern
Mine as well.
“Yeah we suck, be there is a chance we could suck slightly more if we try to correct the problem.” - Art Deuce (summarized by SteelPerch)
Jeemie wrote:Ice wrote:swissvale72 wrote:Steelers are a MUCH worse team without Antonio Brown. It's that fuckin' simple.
I don't think we know that for sure. If you're using the Bungles game as evidence, much of the offensive turmoil was BECAUSE OF Antonio Brown.
If I trusted Mike Tomlin to oversee the rebuild, I'd be much more inclined to take the risk of letting AB go.
I think you keep pretty much the same personnel, allow Ben to spread it around, which is when he's at his very best, and see what happens. I'm willing to bet we'll be fine. Wouldn't mind adding Parris Campbell in the draft, per STD, because he's a huge character guy and a speedy mother who's made some tremendous catches for my Bucks. We'll be good, maybe better.
On offense, at least, no need for a rebuild.
Nothing left to do but smile, smile, smile...
Jeemie wrote:
Damn I hate this passive aggressive "protect my ego" shit.
That's Antonio letting Art II know the message was received and understood (although it DOESN'T mean AB is gonna behave himself if given another chance).
I don’t see it that way. I think it’s AB responding to A2s stating that he can’t see AB remaining a Steeler. Business is booming...we’ve got a deal. He wants out.
Still Lit wrote:
That suit....Jesus....
Horrid.
#NoMoTomlin
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Jobus Rum wrote:Jeemie wrote:
Damn I hate this passive aggressive "protect my ego" shit.
That's Antonio letting Art II know the message was received and understood (although it DOESN'T mean AB is gonna behave himself if given another chance).
I don’t see it that way. I think it’s AB responding to A2s stating that he can’t see AB remaining a Steeler. Business is booming...we’ve got a deal. He wants out.
Interesting.
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KC wrote:swissvale72 wrote:Steelers are a MUCH worse team without Antonio Brown. It's that fuckin' simple.
Not the Antonio Brown ignoring his coaches and teammates. Not the ego driven Antonio Brown who is constantly bitching to Roethlisberger about his targets and how they aren't enough.
Not the AB that was ALMOST CERTAINLY jealous as fuck about Juju winning team MVP. Not the Antonio Brown who has become more about Antonio Brown being marketed than winning football games.
If we trade AB for a nice haul, I'll bet you see Ben have an outstanding year and we return to the playoffs.
Why? No more forcing throws to a blanketed AB and much more spreading it around.
The AB we currently have....well, I'm not at all surprised this team is dysfunctional as fuck.
Tomlin, as much as I loathe the piece of shit, is still our coach. He needs to take back FULL CONTROL of this team and if that means jettisoning AB and his massive ego, I'm ALL FOR IT.
It's the Leveon Bell debate all over again.
Jobus Rum wrote:Jeemie wrote:
Damn I hate this passive aggressive "protect my ego" shit.
That's Antonio letting Art II know the message was received and understood (although it DOESN'T mean AB is gonna behave himself if given another chance).
I don’t see it that way. I think it’s AB responding to A2s stating that he can’t see AB remaining a Steeler. Business is booming...we’ve got a deal. He wants out.
Yes- it could be seen as that as well.
“Yeah we suck, be there is a chance we could suck slightly more if we try to correct the problem.” - Art Deuce (summarized by SteelPerch)
Still Lit wrote:
That suit....Jesus....
I’d trade his ass just for the ridiculous looking suit alone.
And I’m a suit wearin guy.
Jobus Rum wrote:Jeemie wrote:
Damn I hate this passive aggressive "protect my ego" shit.
That's Antonio letting Art II know the message was received and understood (although it DOESN'T mean AB is gonna behave himself if given another chance).
I don’t see it that way. I think it’s AB responding to A2s stating that he can’t see AB remaining a Steeler. Business is booming...we’ve got a deal. He wants out.
Hard to know what he meant from a short unconcise tweet but if I had to go one way or the other at this point I’d lean toward not seeing that way as well Jobus.
I took it as...
Art2: Considering all options. Won’t release him but also don’t foresee him in camp at this point.
AB: Good. Business (as in AB business) be boomin.
Who the fuck knows however. Evident AB is not the brightest of bulbs.
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“My belief is there’s more to it than an incident one day at practice,” Rooney said. “That’s one of the reasons I would have liked to talk to him about it — what it was and how it got to this point.”
How it got to this point???
How can the owner of the team not know how it’s gotten to this point?” WTF?
Hey Art maybe tune into Aditi K on Pete kings podcast and at least get the gist ya barrel of monkey nuts!
I want to go back to liking the Steelers.
Fire Butler
Tomlin won’t get fired but hopefully contract not renewed/extended
Trade AB. Hopefully for much more than a 5th rd pick
I need to de-sour on Ben because he’s not going anywhere
Art2 needs replaced as owner. Little brother Daniel ready yet?
Nick Markakis on Astros: "Every guy over there needs a beating."
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SteelDrama wrote:“My belief is there’s more to it than an incident one day at practice,” Rooney said. “That’s one of the reasons I would have liked to talk to him about it — what it was and how it got to this point.”
How it got to this point???
How can the owner of the team not know how it’s gotten to this point?” WTF?
Hey Art maybe tune into Aditi K on Pete kings podcast and at least get the gist ya barrel of monkey nuts!
I want to go back to liking the Steelers.
Fire Butler
Tomlin won’t get fired but hopefully contract not renewed/extended
Trade AB. Hopefully for much more than a 5th rd pick
I need to de-sour on Ben because he’s not going anywhere
Art2 needs replaced as owner. Little brother Daniel ready yet?
Your poasting handle is perfect for these dark times, however. Obviously a prescient choice on your part.
Scunge wrote:Havoc, one other stat that has been bothering me the past couple seasons with Brown is that he really has a lower first down percentage than other WRs. What does that mean? Well, how many of his catches are going for first downs?? Moving the chains, etc.
I look around and see that many of the great WRs, many of the very good WRs all have first down percentages in the 70s, even 80%.
Mike Evans and Kenny Golladay were at 80%.
The Rams Robert Woods as at 77%
Alston Jeffrey and Amari Cooper were at 74%
Julio Jones and Hopkins and Tyler Boyd, Brandin Cooks they were all between 70-72%
Where was Antonion Brown on this list for first down percentage??
Brown was all the way down at 60.6%
So, Ben was completing 61.9% of his passing attempts to Brown and only 60.6% of those passes resulted in first downs. And then look at all of the INTs that Ben threw trying to fit passes into Brown. How many INTs? 7,8? That is a special connection, really??
There are a lot of QB/WR combos out there where they are completing 70-75% of their passes and those completed passes are going for first downs 70% of the time and yet the Ben to Brown connection is special??
Interesting stuff, Scunge
AB's gawdy numbers of the past remind me of Kobe Bryant in the nba when Kobe had his highest scoring season. Kobe jacked up a crazy number of shots that season, 27 shots per game. The Lakers rs record was 45 -37 and they lost in the first round of the playoffs. So what did those PPG numbers Kobe put up that season really mean? Well, if you want to be a championship team, they were useless garbage, empty numbers.
AB's gawdy numbers of the past to a degree are empty numbers, like Kobe Bryant's highest ppg season. Show me numbers that mean getting to the SB, winning the SB. Show me numbers that contributed to the highest scoring offense in the league.
The more I think about this, the more I'm on board with moving AB. AB is a HOFer, and he's also a little overrated by some in Steelers Nation, and many in the media.
This team has been too much about entertainment the past several years (before Fichtner), like Kobe entertaining the lower basketball IQ portion of the Lakers fanbase during his highest ppg season, not enough about championship level substance. Fichtner tried to change that this season, and AB didn't like it.
It's about having enough guys who can get separation and make plays in the passing game. The names on the jerseys do not have to include Antonio Brown.
Last edited by Guest on Fri Jan 11, 2019 5:33 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Throw. The. Football. On. First. Down.
Scunge wrote:I still think there is a money aspect to this as well.
Brown is probably upset that he is making so much less money then other WRs.
Don't give me that per season crap, all Brown is looking at is that OBJ signed for $95 million, or that Evans signed for $82 million, or that cooks signed for $80 million, meanwhile poor Antonio had to settle for $68!!
I bet this is a ploy to get more money out of the Steelers and if traded to get more money out of his new team too.
I think any trade will be contingent upon Brown getting paid more, getting a new contract.
Ding, ding, ding!
Money is a big part of it, imo. AB thinks he's the LeBron/Jordan of the NFL (or wants to be). He wants to be paid the most, live somewhere more conducive to growing his brand, and turning his brand into some sort of conglomerate money making business. He sees the opportunity to accomplish some of that by getting traded, mark my words.
My guess is, MIA, LA or NY are his first choices. Somewhere the city is big enough and the competition from another high-profile WR (JuJu) isn't as strong.
I always find it interesting (a great case study, if you will) when people that came from nothing, with very little education and mentorship, reach fame and fortune and then screw it all up because of their own bloated ego and various undoings. Most aren't even smart enough to get out of their own way. It's kind of sad, too, I guess.
44LetzRide wrote:Losing Bell & Brown back to back? I'm not buying it. The door isn't closed until it's closed. Why bother extending Ben? Couldn't win the SB with #26 & #84, far less likely to win it without them.
Did we ever have a healthy #26 & #84 in a playoff run?
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Quixotic wrote:44LetzRide wrote:Losing Bell & Brown back to back? I'm not buying it. The door isn't closed until it's closed. Why bother extending Ben? Couldn't win the SB with #26 & #84, far less likely to win it without them.
Did we ever have a healthy #26 & #84 in a playoff run?
Jacksonville last year and we put up 42 vs the league's #1 defense.
“We are the stupidest fucking franchise ever.” — Smithessmokin
And still lost. To a team QB’d by Blake Bortles.
The Steel Curtain rolled over in its grave that day...
The Steel Curtain rolled over in its grave that day...
bradshaw2ben wrote:Quixotic wrote:44LetzRide wrote:Losing Bell & Brown back to back? I'm not buying it. The door isn't closed until it's closed. Why bother extending Ben? Couldn't win the SB with #26 & #84, far less likely to win it without them.
Did we ever have a healthy #26 & #84 in a playoff run?
Jacksonville last year and we put up 42 vs the league's #1 defense.
Only because we were behind, forcing the dumbass Mike Tomlin to keep his foot on the gas pedal.
My former college football coach buddy says the Steelers are a better come from behind team, don't play as well with a lead. He says that's coaching. He's right.
Last edited by Guest on Fri Jan 11, 2019 9:16 pm, edited 2 times in total.
Throw. The. Football. On. First. Down.
I think any trade will be contingent upon Brown getting paid more, getting a new contract.
Why? Does his current contract include a no-trade clause?
If not, send his ass to the worst situation that gives us the best offer.
Orangesteel wrote:Still Lit wrote:
That suit....Jesus....
I dig the suit. It has a Von Dutch/Ed Hardy look to it.
sarcasm.....?
