Steelers pick up fifth-year option on David DeCastro

[Legacy User]

Harrison or Tomlinson in the 3 or 4th round is an immediate upgrade to DeCastro???! Ok bud. Might want to think about cutting back on the reefer.

This is like grade school shit. Considering you watch this stuff more than me I would had figured that you knew this already.

Decastro is a good G.

But last year every rats IDL whipped his ass, every Jets IDL whipped his ass, and Gerald Mccoy whipped his ass when matched against him.

Harrison is more powerful at the point and better in pass pro. Tomlinson is a very similar player but my opinion is he is slightly more powerful at the point and moves just as well.

To often we let a good players draft position convince us he is an elite player.

[Legacy User]

Last year the Rats and Jets DLs whipped everyone's ass.

[Legacy User]

Overpaying your own FAs because you don't have a better option is just like overdraftting for need.

I did not consider Pouncey a need because it was demonstrated in '13 he was not and he got crazy money anyway. Probably some kind of gesture to Ben like Colon getting crazy money out of loyalty for a Super Bowl. Whatever the hell that sort of "despite me" meant. Gilbert got crazy money without even looking like any kind of improvement over say a young Max Starks, if even that.

I think moving guard DeCastro brings more need than Pouncey and certainly more skill that Gilbert. They way they have worked it they cannot expect to sign DeCastro for the hometown discount.

Paint meet corner.

[Legacy User]

Harrison or Tomlinson in the 3 or 4th round is an immediate upgrade to DeCastro???! Ok bud. Might want to think about cutting back on the reefer.

This is like grade school shit. Considering you watch this stuff more than me I would had figured that you knew this already.

Decastro is a good G.

But last year every rats IDL whipped his ass, every Jets IDL whipped his ass, and Gerald Mccoy whipped his ass when matched against him.

Harrison is more powerful at the point and better in pass pro. Tomlinson is a very similar player but my opinion is he is slightly more powerful at the point and moves just as well.

To often we let a good players draft position convince us he is an elite player.

That is the Steelers’ philosophy. They like move guards and the more the merrier. Like when Kendoll went down and Key Vincent came in and immediately protected the pocket so much better. It did not matter, Key left the team for Rat City and Kendoll kept his job as passing down turnstile.

IMO, what DeCastro lacks in that last 15 to 30 pounds of immovable bulk in pass pro, he makes up for in high mobility. I think few guards have that versatility. As it stands, he is above the Mendoza line in pass pro. I think he can tweak it some get to more standoffs against the heavy hitters.

I would be absolutely stunned if he did not get a C2.

[Legacy User]

If I were a betting man, I would wager that 4-5 people on this board are capable of evaluating IOL play.

[Kodiak]

I would be absolutely stunned if he did not get a C2.

Inconceivable to me they would pay Gilbert and not Decastro. If they didn't struggle so badly to draft OL I would have probably paid Beachum and let Gilbert walk. I think they should have at least let the market set Gilbert's value (would say the same for Foster).

[Legacy User]

If I were a betting man, I would wager that 4-5 people on this board are capable of evaluating IOL play.

I'll never claim expert evaluator but my eyeballs tell me that DeCastro is great on the move and equal to or better than Faneca in pass pro.

My 2 cents

I would be absolutely stunned if he did not get a C2.

Inconceivable to me they would pay Gilbert and not Decastro. If they didn't struggle so badly to draft OL I would have probably paid Beachum and let Gilbert walk. I think they should have at least let the market set Gilbert's value (would say the same for Foster).

Pretty much agree, I cant believe that anyone was waiting to throw a barrel full of money at Gilbert that he might had whiffed on anyway. I would not be surprised if they could had taken the Gilbert contract, chop it in half, and given one half to Gilbert and one half to Beachum. I guess with incentives, idk.

[tbsteel]

Faneca played in a different era. Football now hardly resembles what the game was like 10-12 years ago. DeCastro is routinely asked to drop back in pass pro 40 or more times on most Sundays.

[Jobu]

If I were a betting man, I would wager that 4-5 people on this board are capable of evaluating IOL play.

Yeah...it's fewer than that!

[Legacy User]

Faneca played in a different era. Football now hardly resembles what the game was like 10-12 years ago. DeCastro is routinely asked to drop back in pass pro 40 or more times on most Sundays.

Yeah it is a different era. Then when they passed it was pas pro. Today its screens, dump offs, bubble screens, less than 5 yards passes and that's hardly pass pro. That means getting up field and blocking for the ball carrier. He's pretty good at that.

Even if I'm not supposed to say so because who I'm I to evaluate or even comment. I think I'll get that paint drying background and look at that from now on.

[Legacy User]

Decastro couldn't carry Faneca's jock.

It isn't close. Faneca had lapses in pass pro but annihilated every 3 tech in the NFL in the run game. Decastro get's walked in both pass pro and the run game...look at that TB game, if Mccoy doesn't walk him 4 yards deep into the backfield and into Bell we likely convert that third down and win that game. If it weren't for Gilbert's difficulties with Dumervil he would have been the worst Olineman on the field in every rats game.

I wouldn't even consider paying him contract 2. Unless it's a Yanda level G it makes no sense to sign any G to contract 2. Most of the time you can take the best G in the draft in round 2. Due to the rookie cap that means you are paying him about 2 million a year and you will be getting at least a Decastro level player. That beats the shit out of 8 million per. Due to the rookie cap and current trends in draft evaluations, I never pay a G, an ILB, or RB contract 2 unless they are elite.

Heyward and Beachum should be the priorities, no one else is worth considering at the moment.

[Kodiak]

^^^ that's one of your more interesting posts. I mostly agree with a lot of it.

But as for Decastro, the 5th year option means they don't really have to do anything this year.

[stinger8]

The Steelers just invested another $100 million in their franchise quarterback last month. It should not go without notice that they are also investing heavily in the offensive linemen that protects him.

On Thursday, the Steelers picked up the fifth year option on guard David DeCastro, who will earn $8 million in 2016 if the Steelers do not negotiate a long-term deal with him before then.

The Steelers already have two other starting offensive linemen signed to lucrative long-term contracts and hope to complete another with left tackle Kelvin Beachum before the start of the season.

In 2016, center Maurkice Pouncey will count $10.5 million against the salary cap. Right tackle Marcus Gilbert will count $6.4 million against the cap.

This an excerpt from a Ray Fitipaldo article. Is it possible to make $8MM on the last year of your first contract? Decastro aint worth $8 large, not yet. Pouncey $10.5MM?? You think Belicheck pays his center $5MM let alone $10 plus. He traded a pro bowl guard making less last year on the eve of the season no less. We know where Troys money is going now. This is very highly paid slightly above average O line. They are good a moving, average at pass blocking and lousy in short yardage need a tough half yard situations.

[Legacy User]

Decastro couldn't carry Faneca's jock.

It isn't close. Faneca had lapses in pass pro but annihilated every 3 tech in the NFL in the run game. Decastro get's walked in both pass pro and the run game...look at that TB game, if Mccoy doesn't walk him 4 yards deep into the backfield and into Bell we likely convert that third down and win that game. If it weren't for Gilbert's difficulties with Dumervil he would have been the worst Olineman on the field in every rats game.

I wouldn't even consider paying him contract 2. Unless it's a Yanda level G it makes no sense to sign any G to contract 2. Most of the time you can take the best G in the draft in round 2. Due to the rookie cap that means you are paying him about 2 million a year and you will be getting at least a Decastro level player. That beats the shit out of 8 million per. Due to the rookie cap and current trends in draft evaluations, I never pay a G, an ILB, or RB contract 2 unless they are elite.

Heyward and Beachum should be the priorities, no one else is worth considering at the moment.

I cant comment because I'm not anointed by the supreme judgement of the loud mouthed peanut gallery to evaluate. So enjoy the echo chamber.

[bradshaw2ben]

I think I agree entirely with Clemson and Stinger's posts above. Loyalty works both ways: "We believe in you guys and we're building the best team possible...with that in mind, this is the amount we can pay you. If you want to go somewhere else we'll be unhappy, but this is the price that works."

Overpaying average performers because of loyalty or, worse, continuity, is stupid.

Belichik and Co have it right... they have loyalty, but if you don't want to play for what we offer, then we'll have to move on from you-- especially at non premium positions like RB, IOL, ILB, even blocking TE. We have so much money tied up in IOL & ILB and soon to RB-- we'll literally have the most $ tied up in those non premium positions of any team in the NFL.

[Kodiak]

We have so much money tied up in IOL & ILB and soon to RB-- we'll literally have the most $ tied up in those non premium positions of any team in the NFL.

Really interesting point. Seems like if you're going to have a high-paid OL, then you should be plugging-and-playing cheaper RB's. But Bell looks to be a special talent and I don't know how you could let him go.

Unfortunately I think PIT is going to lock all these guys up with little concern for overpaying average players. IMO, it's a rather desperate move. It's one thing to borrow from the future to pay a bunch of current and developing stars, it's quite another to overpay average guys because you fear drafting worse.

I like Pouncey and Decastro, and Beachum at the right price. Gilbert and Foster are guys I'd have no issue walking if the market wanted to overpay them. Not that it's an either/or, or that it will happen, but there's not a guy on the OL that should take Bell's money.

[V DUB]

So, according to the board, we're overpaying a ton of guys at the moment, while only a few pieces away from a solid top to bottom roster, & whIle still having cap space we haven't had since 3 rivers stadium was still hosting games. Why should I care, if they've positioned themselves nicely for Ben's stretch run?

It is not & will not handicap the team for the time it matters.

[bradshaw2ben]

beacuse they haven't positioned themselves for a run. The defense is incredibly undermanned, the OL is mediocre, and the lack of red zone or 50/50 weapons makes us unduly finesse, which doesn't translate vs physical teams.

[Obviously]

I think I agree entirely with Clemson and Stinger's posts above. Loyalty works both ways: "We believe in you guys and we're building the best team possible...with that in mind, this is the amount we can pay you. If you want to go somewhere else we'll be unhappy, but this is the price that works."

Overpaying average performers because of loyalty or, worse, continuity, is stupid.

Belichik and Co have it right... they have loyalty, but if you don't want to play for what we offer, then we'll have to move on from you-- especially at non premium positions like RB, IOL, ILB, even blocking TE. We have so much money tied up in IOL & ILB and soon to RB-- we'll literally have the most $ tied up in those non premium positions of any team in the NFL.

Agreed. Couldn't have said it any better.

[V DUB]

beacuse they haven't positioned themselves for a run. The defense is incredibly undermanned, the OL is mediocre, and the lack of red zone or 50/50 weapons makes us unduly finesse, which doesn't translate vs physical teams.

Flip side of that is they're a mismatch TE away from a stacked offense, with guys that are just starting to come on, the OL still being groomed by a second year HOF coach & drafted replacements high on the D side that haven't been in the league long enough for us to form an opinion on. They were drafted highly...wisely at the time.. The only position we haven't accounted for either through FA or draft is CB 2, & that'll be dealt with in a few weeks. All that with a shit ton of cap space, ATM.

I can't criticize the FO for not having Jedi like precognitive skills with players. As they currently sit they've done a good job of at least throwing whatever resources they had at their disposal at the problem areas on the roster. And they have the draft still.

[lifelongsteel]

Man, i was happy we picked up his option. Should have read this thread first so that I could have been pissed and depressed instead.

btw - enough with the Pats personnel genius shit. It's just off base. Sure they jettison guys early, but there is really no indication that this helps them rather than hurts them.

Quick summary of why the Pats win more:
Better coach
Better QB
Easier division

It's not rocket science

[bradshaw2ben]

coach(es) better at fitting players to system and vice versa
QB has system designed to him
division sucks
they are the most innovative and analytics-oriented organization in sports
they cheat like MFers

[Stosh-67]

coach(es) better at fitting players to system and vice versa
QB has system designed to him
division sucks
they are the most innovative and analytics-oriented organization in sports
they cheat like MFers

Bingo..........
correct on all points.........
coaches leave no stone unturned.
design game plans to attack weakness of each specific opponent...........
QB goes untouched most of the game.......due to game planning, explotation of matchups, picks, rubs, ........smart QB
over the last 15 years..........between the Jets, Bills, and Dolphins.................it was mostly an easy 5 out of 6 division wins.........( 5-1 or 6-0)
which means..........6-4 or 7-3 in the remaining 10 non-division games usually got a 1 or 2 seed.....home field advantage, rest, etc.......
other than Rex Ryans back to back AFC championship appearance teams.........that division has presented nothing......
cheating like no other team in sports.................

[Stosh-67]

over the last 15 years..........between the Jets, Bills, and Dolphins.................it was mostly an easy 5 out of 6 division wins.........( 5-1 or 6-0)

on the other hand......
play in a tuff division....in which a 3-3 divisoin record may be a success..........or 4-2 on a good year........
means a team needs to go 8-2 or 7-3 outside the division.....to get a 10 or 11 win season........

[Jobu]

Allow me...

coach(es) better at fitting players to system and vice versa(pretty smart)
they cheat like MFers
QB has system designed to him(nothing brilliant here. This is how it should be)
they cheat like MFers
division sucks(duh )
they cheat like MFers
they are the most innovative and analytics-oriented organization in sports(kudos)
they cheat like Mfers
they cheat like MFers

Did anyone mention they cheat like MFers?

[Thrillsseeker]

coach(es) better at fitting players to system and vice versa
QB has system designed to him
division sucks
they are the most innovative and analytics-oriented organization in sports
they cheat like MFers

Bingo..........
correct on all points.........
coaches leave no stone unturned.
design game plans to attack weakness of each specific opponent...........
QB goes untouched most of the game.......due to game planning, explotation of matchups, picks, rubs, ........smart QB
over the last 15 years..........between the Jets, Bills, and Dolphins.................it was mostly an easy 5 out of 6 division wins.........( 5-1 or 6-0)
which means..........6-4 or 7-3 in the remaining 10 non-division games usually got a 1 or 2 seed.....home field advantage, rest, etc.......
other than Rex Ryans back to back AFC championship appearance teams.........that division has presented nothing......
cheating like no other team in sports.................

I agree with that division has offered no challenge to them at all. Fucking joke. Lets hope with the Bills, Miami, (Jets even though will continue to suck) making splashes in FA that it pays off and Suh can break Marshas leg or some shit.

Maybe McCoy can run a sweep and run full speed into Marsha standing on the sideline.

I'll close this rant with another opinion I have about NE and the fucking ballwashing of the last 10+ years: as I was driving in this am to work and they were doing their normal ballwashing of NE and Brady specifically. Ex players were just in AWE over Brady and his accomplishments. Talking about what he's done, how he's done this or that blah blah blah, best ever played the game blah blah blah, the radio host (again ex player) was just over the top baffled about how he could be so great. Like an anomaly, beating statistics etc. The other host responds well it's been that way because they have been deflating footballs, and then they both laughed.

My own personal thoughts are and we will never know for sure: Tom fucking brady has had help from the jump. From the disappearance of any discussion about an extra radio frequency from back in the original cheating scandal. Shit went away like the wind. I say Brady is great because they're cheating mother fuckers up there in NE. I've known cheaters in life, we all know someone that has cheated. Some cheaters are WAY worse than others. No matter what the person cheated on. The severity etc can be at different levels etc, BUT one thing I know is that if your cheating and caught once, twice etc. your cheating a whole fuck of a lot more than the times you got caught.

I will literally not miss a chance for the rest of my days claiming Brady was made great by fucking cheating.

At the store the other day, I say to my 6 yr old, hey buddy, did you see that guys shirt? He's wearing a cheaters t-shirt. He's 6 and he will grow up knowing those mother fuckers cheat.

[Jobu]

coach(es) better at fitting players to system and vice versa
QB has system designed to him
division sucks
they are the most innovative and analytics-oriented organization in sports
they cheat like MFers

Bingo..........
correct on all points.........
coaches leave no stone unturned.
design game plans to attack weakness of each specific opponent...........
QB goes untouched most of the game.......due to game planning, explotation of matchups, picks, rubs, ........smart QB
over the last 15 years..........between the Jets, Bills, and Dolphins.................it was mostly an easy 5 out of 6 division wins.........( 5-1 or 6-0)
which means..........6-4 or 7-3 in the remaining 10 non-division games usually got a 1 or 2 seed.....home field advantage, rest, etc.......
other than Rex Ryans back to back AFC championship appearance teams.........that division has presented nothing......
cheating like no other team in sports.................

I agree with that division has offered no challenge to them at all. Fucking joke. Lets hope with the Bills, Miami, (Jets even though will continue to suck) making splashes in FA that it pays off and Suh can break Marshas leg or some shit.

Maybe McCoy can run a sweep and run full speed into Marsha standing on the sideline.

I'll close this rant with another opinion I have about NE and the fucking ballwashing of the last 10+ years: as I was driving in this am to work and they were doing their normal ballwashing of NE and Brady specifically. Ex players were just in AWE over Brady and his accomplishments. Talking about what he's done, how he's done this or that blah blah blah, best ever played the game blah blah blah, the radio host (again ex player) was just over the top baffled about how he could be so great. Like an anomaly, beating statistics etc. The other host responds well it's been that way because they have been deflating footballs, and then they both laughed.

My own personal thoughts are and we will never know for sure: Tom fucking brady has had help from the jump. From the disappearance of any discussion about an extra radio frequency from back in the original cheating scandal. Shit went away like the wind. I say Brady is great because they're cheating mother fuckers up there in NE. I've known cheaters in life, we all know someone that has cheated. Some cheaters are WAY worse than others. No matter what the person cheated on. The severity etc can be at different levels etc, BUT one thing I know is that if your cheating and caught once, twice etc. your cheating a whole fuck of a lot more than the times you got caught.

I will literally not miss a chance for the rest of my days claiming Brady was made great by fucking cheating.

At the store the other day, I say to my 6 yr old, hey buddy, did you see that guys shirt? He's wearing a cheaters t-shirt. He's 6 and he will grow up knowing those mother fuckers cheat.

Good post Seeker!

[Kodiak]

the 5th year option is basically a transition tag that doesn't count against the number of tags you can use...no real risk to doing it, and it doesn't prevent an extension next year to reduce that $8M cap hit.

But consider this: Yanda is the highest paid RG in the NFL, with his contract averaging $6.4M per year. Top-5 RG money is probably heading just north of $6M per year.

[bradshaw2ben]

$8M for a guard who isn't arguably the best in the NFL is laughable, so let's hope they figure out a way to make that work.

Lance Armstrong and Barry Bonds. They are the last guys I can recall who were defying all the odds and doing stuff several deviations from the norm. Not just being a little better generally or being a lot better on some occasions-- being literally the best all the time. In Lance's case, when he cheated a little, he went from determined, talented athlete to world champion at his second or third best sport... a very good single day, mostly flat road race. (Brady a decent college QB with zero athleticism) Then, in a matter of months, Armstrong became the best vs the clock AND the best hill climber and the best multi-day racer. He was literally the best hill climber in the world by a couple deviations-- a specialty in which he had been one of the worst among professionals before he had cancer. (see Brady, Tom)

So, they may not be out and out cheating all the time, but their performance vs other teams over a long period of time would seem to indicate otherwise. Brady, Armstrong, Belechik-- all had achieved some success but hadn't shown the greatness in their professions until some threshold was crossed.

Much like Armstrong, I think it's only a matter of time before Brady/Belechik are revealed to be who they are.

[Kodiak]

Much like Armstrong, I think it's only a matter of time before Brady/Belechik are revealed to be who they are.

The standard deviations above great is a good corollary...and I think you're right that it's almost always, maybe always, an indication of an illicit advantage(s). The way Brady was getting the ball out in 1.2 seconds - and winning - flies in the face of all the empirical evidence of balance and throwing the ball downfield. NE basically has a think-tank dreaming up micro-advantages, legal and illegal, that add-up to be pretty significant.

As for Lance, the cancer did reshape his body to allow him to become a better climber. His VO2 max and lactic acid threshold were also pretty off the charts...so I think he's more an all-time great naturally, like a Bonds, that entered the GOAT discussion with drugs, like Bonds. Cycling is more of a team sport than most people probably realize, and that's maybe where the drugs had the biggest effect on Lance's dominance.