Next April's draft better be ALL ABOUT protecting Ben.

[Legacy User]

Kind of interesting to me no one is flat out denying that the 100 million dollar leader of the team isn't out of shape. Agree with Drama. Asked a few friends of mine yesterday (neutral observers who could care less) and all agreed Ben looks like shit this year physically. And anyone who thinks Ben is half as mobile as he was 5 years ago is nuts. 33 and in shit shape playing in the NFL is a recipe for a lot of injuries. It's not really debatable for me.

Jacoby Jones is 31 and looks 10 times slower than he did in the prime of his career... is he out of shape? The difference between he and Ben is that Ben can still play his position at a pro-bowl caliber level in comparison to other QB's in the league, whereas someone like Jones is getting cut from teams.

I think people are using injuries to stir up some odd fascination some on this board have with looks, frame, fitness - whatever.

[steeledge]

Was having a chat with a Pats fan this morning. We were talking about the Ben injury and how his age factored into it. I asked him well why hasn't Brady gone down with injury as often since he's three years older. He went on to wax poetically about Brady's new diet and his new stretching exercises which has been talked about on BSPN and other outlets. I told him he's full of shit. The reason why Brady doesn't go down with injury is because Belichick and the Patriots FO are smart enough to put a REAL offensive line in front of him. I also told him that our genius HC said long ago that the way to protect Ben was to put weapons around him (JL58 mentioned in earlier in this thread). Well they have put weapons around Ben and he continues to get hurt.

I'm with you that your friend is full of shit, and we all know about BSPN...
But I disagree that Brady's key to success is the OL that he and The Cheat have put in front of him.

Brady doesn't go down with injury because he gets rid of the ball way too fast.
That whole offense is designed around his pansy assed style of play, and it works.
It also makes his OL look All Pro...

But that type of quick-hit offense is not a fit for Ben, and I don't know that he could play that way and stay competitive.
By contrast, Ben's style of holding onto the ball to make a play would make even the Patsies' OL look pedestrian or worse.

But that's Ben, and I wouldn't change a thing...

[stinger8]

Kind of interesting to me no one is flat out denying that the 100 million dollar leader of the team isn't out of shape. Agree with Drama. Asked a few friends of mine yesterday (neutral observers who could care less) and all agreed Ben looks like shit this year physically. And anyone who thinks Ben is half as mobile as he was 5 years ago is nuts. 33 and in shit shape playing in the NFL is a recipe for a lot of injuries. It's not really debatable for me.[/quote]


I have been beating this fuckin drum hard, along with my hero R O N, for about 2 years. I am not suggesting Ben may have not gotten hurt even if excellent shape. My issue is and was always that you make the dough he makes you have a fiduciary (moral), obligation to be in the best shape you can be. You can afford the best personal trainer(s), and also the best nutritionist (and that's as important as working out)money can buy. You owe it to Steeler nation, you owe it to your team mates, coaches, owner, everyone. Don't like the responsibility, fine don't fuckin take the dough. Here are some beautiful Fury replies.
1) He dont have ta train, he is "country" strong.
2) He needs to rest after a grueling season. Do you realize how hard a QB practices all week? He takes 60 to 80 shots over 17 weeks and he is exhausted and needs 4 months to recuperate. A triathlon is grueling, climbing Mount Everest is grueling, riding the tour de France is grueling, wearing shorts and throwing a football Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and getting tackled 6 times on Sunday is not grueling SMH.
3) Yeah look at Brady Quinn he was in shape how did that work out. Brady Quinn was working out to be an under wear model, Ben does not need to that, but he needs core training, flexibility, agility work, foot work, and to drop about 20 lbs

Lastly Lev Bell senior season 235, high draft choice. Year 1 NFL 225, better than ever. Year 2 215, better still. D Willimas older guy dropped weight this year looks like he did when he was 27. Its just common sense

[R_S]

I think Ben would rather retire than work his ass off all offseason, lifting, running and eating a strict diet.

[Legacy User]

2) He needs to rest after a grueling season. Do you realize how hard a QB practices all week? He takes 60 to 80 shots over 17 weeks and he is exhausted and needs 4 months to recuperate. A triathlon is grueling, climbing Mount Everest is grueling, riding the tour de France is grueling, wearing shorts and throwing a football Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and getting tackled 6 times on Sunday is not grueling SMH.

It's not nothing either. Would you say this season has been a little....strenuous for Ben?

[Legacy User]

3) Yeah look at Brady Quinn he was in shape how did that work out. Brady Quinn was working out to be an under wear model, Ben does not need to that, but he needs core training, flexibility, agility work, foot work, and to drop about 20 lbs

Ben Roethlisbergers draft weight was 241 lbs. According to NFL.com his current weight is 240 lbs. Take it for what it's worth.

Ben drops 20 lbs, he goes down a hell of a lot easier.

[stinger8]

3) Yeah look at Brady Quinn he was in shape how did that work out. Brady Quinn was working out to be an under wear model, Ben does not need to that, but he needs core training, flexibility, agility work, foot work, and to drop about 20 lbs

Ben Roethlisbergers draft weight was 241 lbs. According to NFL.com his current weight is 240 lbs. Take it for what it's worth.

Ben drops 20 lbs, he goes down a hell of a lot easier.

I would bet, $1000 of my own money Ben steps on a scale right now and he is minimum 260, probably 265. I think there are dozens of well know stories where guys are listed well below their actual weight Didn't Levon Kirkland and Casey Hampton weigh significantly more than reported weight?

[stinger8]

2) He needs to rest after a grueling season. Do you realize how hard a QB practices all week? He takes 60 to 80 shots over 17 weeks and he is exhausted and needs 4 months to recuperate. A triathlon is grueling, climbing Mount Everest is grueling, riding the tour de France is grueling, wearing shorts and throwing a football Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and getting tackled 6 times on Sunday is not grueling SMH.

It's not nothing either. Would you say this season has been a little....strenuous for Ben?

I would say this season has been "painful" for Ben but not grueling (exhausting, demanding etc). My point is trying to say you need 4 months of rest because of the grueling nature of a football season, for a QB is just laughable. James Harrison would have a grueling season, taking on big O lineman on 80% of the plays running every play, taking physical contact 90% of the time. I bet the dude takes 2 weeks off and get back at it. No reason a QB can't as well. It would extend his career and make him more effective, I.E. scrambling, avoiding pressure.

[Stosh-67]

3) Yeah look at Brady Quinn he was in shape how did that work out. Brady Quinn was working out to be an under wear model, Ben does not need to that, but he needs core training, flexibility, agility work, foot work, and to drop about 20 lbs

Ben Roethlisbergers draft weight was 241 lbs. According to NFL.com his current weight is 240 lbs. Take it for what it's worth.

Ben drops 20 lbs, he goes down a hell of a lot easier.

I think that playing weight is tagged to a player his rookie year and does not change during his career.
Casey Hamptons playing weight said 325..........
I don't think it ever changed.....even when he came to came in a moo-moo his last year or two and was probably 350-360+ easy at the start of camp.
he shared that moo-moo thur the years with Starks and Woodley.
Starks was probably 4 bills his last go around...........no roster ever documented that?
Woodley was 280-290 his last camp.

If Ben's playing weight was listed at 240 coming out................one look at him as a rookie and you can see he has not seen 240 in 10 years







I would say he is easy 255-260
Would love to see him get into the best shape of his life.
Would extend his career.

[Legacy User]

260 lbs... wow - you guys really think that? Jared Lorenzen was 260lbs at his college weight. He was 6'4.. you think Ben looks like that?

I think some of you guys have a really warped reality when it comes to weight.



Waiting for the first "Ben should play LT joke" to come from the gallery soon.

[Legacy User]

Here's something else that's cut into bens mobility: getting dropped to the turf 50+ times a year behind third rate OL. Yes it's true Ben likes to extend plays, but yes its also true no QB still alive has had to endure the busted plays and sheer shitty blocking that Ben has had to.

I'm all for going heavy offense in the draft, but I kind of get the feeling they won't stop rebuilding the front 7 D until mthey have all first round picks at every position AND every backup.

[Legacy User]

I think Ben would rather retire than work his ass off all offseason, lifting, running and eating a strict diet.

I agree with this. Ben is today's Sonny Jurgensen who said he didn't throw with his stomach. Unfortunately the way Ben plays it helps if you can move instead of waddle. For a 33 yo he's pretty fuckin dumpy. It isn't like he's locked in a cubicle 80 hours a week. He has plenty of free time.

[R_S]

Take a tackle a guard and a center.

In the first 4 or 5 picks.

I'm not kidding.

This shit is getting silly.

It's pretty incredible this offense just put up 38 points, 597 total yards, 6.5 yards per rush, 27 first downs and allowed 1 sack. As terrible as they are and all....

[K_C_]

Take a tackle a guard and a center.

In the first 4 or 5 picks.

I'm not kidding.

This shit is getting silly.

It's pretty incredible this offense just put up 38 points, 597 total yards, 6.5 yards per rush, 27 first downs and allowed 1 sack. As terrible as they are and all....

Ben was under plenty of pressure and ended up injured. He took a few really nice shots (and evaded some too with some nice movement in the pocket.) Landry Jones was under serious pressure against KC and took a shitload of hits.

You may not believe we can do better than Villy, Beachum, Wallace or Foster.

I seriously hope to fuck we can or Roethlisberger is going to miss a whole bunch games going forward.

Keep that head in the sand though! Everything's fine.

[R_S]

seeing that 2 of the 4 starters actually are backups, that's some solid production for a backup. Ben will ALWAYS take hits.

[Legacy User]

Take a tackle a guard and a center.

In the first 4 or 5 picks.

I'm not kidding.

This shit is getting silly.

It's pretty incredible this offense just put up 38 points, 597 total yards, 6.5 yards per rush, 27 first downs and allowed 1 sack. As terrible as they are and all....

Ben was under plenty of pressure and ended up injured. He took a few really nice shots (and evaded some too with some nice movement in the pocket.) Landry Jones was under serious pressure against KC and took a shitload of hits.

You may not believe we can do better than Villy, Beachum, Wallace or Foster.

I seriously hope to fuck we can or Roethlisberger is going to miss a whole bunch games going forward.

Keep that head in the sand though! Everything's fine.

Well we cant have everything and Pouncey needs to rain serious money. Think about it, the team has stars at nearly every skill queer position plus a 100 million dollar QB. That will take a huge pile of dough coming soon to ya. Gilbert is getting good money. Pouncey is getting highway robbery money and DD needs to be paid and will say look at Pounceys big fat contract. I'm as good as he is. The run game is smoking and he isnt here. Pay me.

The three on the left side might not be great but they are about as good as this team has seen in the vast majority of Ben's career in Pittsburgh. Not great but not Chris Scott, Todd Fordham, Nwinki, Ross either.

Then again if Landry starts self tackling like Tommy Maddox then there might be a problem there.

[R_S]

Chris Scott remember him playing left tackle! wow. we forget pretty quickly how truly bad this o-line was at one point. The current group is far from perfect, but just remember Chris Scott.

[Legacy User]

Chris Scott remember him playing left tackle! wow. we forget pretty quickly how truly bad this o-line was at one point. The current group is far from perfect, but just remember Chris Scott.

Yeah these lines have been horrible. It was like they had one good player a JAG or two and a couple of Chris Scotts 24/7. Now they are just doing a few fuckups. That's a vast improvement.

[Stosh-67]

260 lbs... wow - you guys really think that? Jared Lorenzen was 260lbs at his college weight. He was 6'4.. you think Ben looks like that?

I think some of you guys have a really warped reality when it comes to weight.



Waiting for the first "Ben should play LT joke" to come from the gallery soon.

Lorenzen was 280+

[Legacy User]

There is about a four year window for the PS to excel. After Ben is gone, it may be decades of mediocrity.

Front office has to do everything they can now to keep him upright in order to get another SB before the window closes.

[Legacy User]

I have been beating this fuckin drum hard, along with my hero R O N, for about 2 years. I am not suggesting Ben may have not gotten hurt even if excellent shape. My issue is and was always that you make the dough he makes you have a fiduciary (moral), obligation to be in the best shape you can be. You can afford the best personal trainer(s), and also the best nutritionist (and that's as important as working out)money can buy. You owe it to Steeler nation, you owe it to your team mates, coaches, owner, everyone. Don't like the responsibility, fine don't fuckin take the dough. Here are some beautiful Fury replies.
1) He dont have ta train, he is "country" strong.
2) He needs to rest after a grueling season. Do you realize how hard a QB practices all week? He takes 60 to 80 shots over 17 weeks and he is exhausted and needs 4 months to recuperate. A triathlon is grueling, climbing Mount Everest is grueling, riding the tour de France is grueling, wearing shorts and throwing a football Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and getting tackled 6 times on Sunday is not grueling SMH.
3) Yeah look at Brady Quinn he was in shape how did that work out. Brady Quinn was working out to be an under wear model, Ben does not need to that, but he needs core training, flexibility, agility work, foot work, and to drop about 20 lbs

Lastly Lev Bell senior season 235, high draft choice. Year 1 NFL 225, better than ever. Year 2 215, better still. D Willimas older guy dropped weight this year looks like he did when he was 27. Its just common sense

You left out (4): Can you explain how being in better shape would have prevented either of Ben's injuries this season? That's got to be the dumbest one, right?

I agree that Ben should work harder in the off season because of his age. I don't think his current physical condition has anything to do with his injuries unless you think being more mobile would have prevented them. Maybe some extreme yoga would have. Can Ben even touch his toes with his legs straight? I wonder.

Ben doesn't owe you, the fan, shit.

[K_C_]

There is about a four year window for the PS to excel. After Ben is gone, it may be decades of mediocrity.

Front office has to do everything they can now to keep him upright in order to get another SB before the window closes.

BINGO.

Some here are too clueless to understand that.

Ben has the weapons.

He does NOT have the protection.

[stinger8]

I have been beating this fuckin drum hard, along with my hero R O N, for about 2 years. I am not suggesting Ben may have not gotten hurt even if excellent shape. My issue is and was always that you make the dough he makes you have a fiduciary (moral), obligation to be in the best shape you can be. You can afford the best personal trainer(s), and also the best nutritionist (and that's as important as working out)money can buy. You owe it to Steeler nation, you owe it to your team mates, coaches, owner, everyone. Don't like the responsibility, fine don't fuckin take the dough. Here are some beautiful Fury replies.
1) He dont have ta train, he is "country" strong.
2) He needs to rest after a grueling season. Do you realize how hard a QB practices all week? He takes 60 to 80 shots over 17 weeks and he is exhausted and needs 4 months to recuperate. A triathlon is grueling, climbing Mount Everest is grueling, riding the tour de France is grueling, wearing shorts and throwing a football Tuesday, Wednesday, Thursday, and getting tackled 6 times on Sunday is not grueling SMH.
3) Yeah look at Brady Quinn he was in shape how did that work out. Brady Quinn was working out to be an under wear model, Ben does not need to that, but he needs core training, flexibility, agility work, foot work, and to drop about 20 lbs

Lastly Lev Bell senior season 235, high draft choice. Year 1 NFL 225, better than ever. Year 2 215, better still. D Willimas older guy dropped weight this year looks like he did when he was 27. Its just common sense

You left out (4): Can you explain how being in better shape would have prevented either of Ben's injuries this season? That's got to be the dumbest one, right?

I agree that Ben should work harder in the off season because of his age. I don't think his current physical condition has anything to do with his injuries unless you think being more mobile would have prevented them. Maybe some extreme yoga would have. Can Ben even touch his toes with his legs straight? I wonder.

Ben doesn't owe you, the fan, shit.

Lit never said being in better shape guarantee's he does not get hurt. I understand the best conditioned athlete stepping into a throw gets hit on the knee, bad shit is gonna happen. However if he is in really good fit shape, he will be more mobile, that is indisputable, and MAYBE he steps a little quicker to avoid a hit and only gets brushed or maybe the guy misses. I totally disagree that he does not owe the fans. He has a responsibility to the fans, his teammates, his coaches, his owner (who gave him $100MM) to be in the best shape he can. No fans, no game, no glory, no money. See how that works. Not real complicated.
Let him or any player come out with a camera in their face and say, I dont owe the fans a thing they can all kiss my ass. See how that works out.
As an aside I am 56 I do yoga and it is incredible for flexibility, which at my age is very necessary and I can touch my toes with knee's straight.

[jeemie]

Ben Roethlisberger's sack percentage this season is 4.8%...a career low.

I use sack percentage in place of total sacks so people won't point out "But he's only played in 3+ games!"

I have to look and see if I can find his hit rate, but I suspect it's down as well.

His two injuries were on a direct shot to the knee and a player falling on his foot. They could have been the only hits he took all year, and he still would have been injured on them.

You can have a stout OL of All Pros, and he's still going to get hit. One- all QBs get hit. Two- Ben's style of play and his desire to try and fight off every sack ensures he's going to get the kinds of hits that are likely to lead to injury.

The entire premise of the OP assumes Ben got hurt because he gets hit so much.

The entire premise of this OP assumes Ben has been getting hurt at a higher rate as he gets older.

Both assumptions are wrong.

Ben isn't getting hit as much....the number of hits has been going down year on year.

Ben had a streak of 39 consecutive starts before going down with his first injury this season.

Thread is classic overreaction.

[K_C_]

Thread is classic overreaction.

Nope, o-line needs to be upgraded.

Pouncey is hurt yearly.

Foster isn't very good.

Villy and Beachum are meh.

Wallace is meh.

Going into Roethlisberger's final years, no question in my mind they will focus on the o-line this April.

[jeemie]

Thread is classic overreaction.

Nope, o-line needs to be upgraded.

Pouncey is hurt yearly.

Foster isn't very good.

Villy and Beachum are meh.

Wallace is meh.

Going into Roethlisberger's final years, no question in my mind they will focus on the o-line this April.

There are upgrades to be had on O-line.

Your premise that the O-line needs to be upgraded by using the top three picks on next year's draft on them because they aren't adequately protecting Ben is completely false.

[K_C_]

Thread is classic overreaction.

Nope, o-line needs to be upgraded.

Pouncey is hurt yearly.

Foster isn't very good.

Villy and Beachum are meh.

Wallace is meh.

Going into Roethlisberger's final years, no question in my mind they will focus on the o-line this April.

There are upgrades to be had on O-line.

Your premise that the O-line needs to be upgraded by using the top three picks on next year's draft on them because they aren't adequately protecting Ben is completely false.

They'll definitely use 2 out of their top 4 picks on the o-line.

They'll also add a DB and DL.

But o-line will be the focus.

Watch and learn.

[StillerInCT]

Ben Roethlisberger's sack percentage this season is 4.8%...a career low.

I use sack percentage in place of total sacks so people won't point out "But he's only played in 3+ games!"

I have to look and see if I can find his hit rate, but I suspect it's down as well.

His two injuries were on a direct shot to the knee and a player falling on his foot. They could have been the only hits he took all year, and he still would have been injured on them.

You can have a stout OL of All Pros, and he's still going to get hit. One- all QBs get hit. Two- Ben's style of play and his desire to try and fight off every sack ensures he's going to get the kinds of hits that are likely to lead to injury.

The entire premise of the OP assumes Ben got hurt because he gets hit so much.

The entire premise of this OP assumes Ben has been getting hurt at a higher rate as he gets older.

Both assumptions are wrong.

Ben isn't getting hit as much....the number of hits has been going down year on year.

Ben had a streak of 39 consecutive starts before going down with his first injury this season.

Thread is classic overreaction.

There's a few spots on the line that can be upgraded. Particularly on the left side of the line.

I'm fine with Pouncey-DD-Gilbert. But you can upgrade one of LT or LG. Beachum in a pinch is more than fine at LT. LG can easily be upgraded, but I wouldn't use a 1st on a guard.

[jeemie]

There's a few spots on the line that can be upgraded. Particularly on the left side of the line.

I'm fine with Pouncey-DD-Gilbert. But you can upgrade one of LT or LG. Beachum in a pinch is more than fine at LT. LG can easily be upgraded, but I wouldn't use a 1st on a guard.

I agree.

I don't disagree with the premise that there are upgrades to be had on the O-line.

i disagree with the premise that we should focus the top end of our draft on O-line picks.

Now- I know nothing about O-line depth in the draft, but I suspect in our draft range, which will be anywhere from 16-32, there will be better prospects at positions such as DB than there will be for O-line.

In the Bud Dupree thread, KC laments the selection of Jarvis Jones.

Jarvis Jones was drafted because we focused on need.

That's what happens when you focus on need instead of BPA.

[StillerInCT]

There's a few spots on the line that can be upgraded. Particularly on the left side of the line.

I'm fine with Pouncey-DD-Gilbert. But you can upgrade one of LT or LG. Beachum in a pinch is more than fine at LT. LG can easily be upgraded, but I wouldn't use a 1st on a guard.

I agree.

I don't disagree with the premise that there are upgrades to be had on the O-line.

i disagree with the premise that we should focus the top end of our draft on O-line picks.

Now- I know nothing about O-line depth in the draft, but I suspect in our draft range, which will be anywhere from 16-32, there will be better prospects at positions such as DB than there will be for O-line.

In the Bud Dupree thread, KC laments the selection of Jarvis Jones.

Jarvis Jones was drafted because we focused on need.

That's what happens when you focus on need instead of BPA.

I agree. I'm all for BPA in R1 and then fill needs in the 2nd and 3rd round if you can get good value. And then take the token stud WR in the 4th.