Tomlin Presser at noon

[StillerInCT]

I thought both comments were funny. If either guy got offended, fuck 'em. Wipe the tears with some of those millions you are making.

One thing about Cowher, he wouldn't have allowed the defense to suck for so long. Not sure what he would have done to improve it other than drafting different players but I have no doubt it would be better. This week I saw a lot more effort to get pressure. It wasn't always successful but I saw them trying. Not sure what took so fucking long to make changes but I hope the effort to be more aggressive continues.

I don't think Cowher ever had to turnover an all-world defense even though he built one. As far as defense building goes, the bar was set REALLY high for Tomlin. It's not easy to replace Aaron Smith, Keisel, Polamalu, Taylor, Clark, Hampton, etc in the midst of a shift to a passing league.

Defense is sure as shit trending up right now. I probably sound like a broken record but I think our defense is now one of the better ones in the league. Wouldn't be surprised if they finish top 5 next season if they can stay healthy.

[StillerDownSouth]

....and I'll add that I don't think Mike Tomlin is an elite coach either.

I wouldn't call him a cheerleader. He's a players coach. A motivator.

He's Bill Cowher reincarnated.

I think.

We'll find out a whole lot more when Roethlisberger retires (unless, like Swiss alluded to, Tomlin takes Ben's exit and gets the hell out too).

Wonder how Belichek will fair when Brady hangs it up? How did he do before Brady showed up? How's Sean Payton been doing with his hall of fame QB. How about Mike McCarthy with Favre and Rodgers.

[stinger8]

....and I'll add that I don't think Mike Tomlin is an elite coach either.

I wouldn't call him a cheerleader. He's a players coach. A motivator.

He's Bill Cowher reincarnated.

I think.

We'll find out a whole lot more when Roethlisberger retires (unless, like Swiss alluded to, Tomlin takes Ben's exit and gets the hell out too).

Wonder how Belichek will fair when Brady hangs it up? How did he do before Brady showed up? How's Sean Payton been doing with his hall of fame QB. How about Mike McCarthy with Favre and Rodgers.

Belichek won 12 games I think with Matt Cassel and he went 3-1 this year without Brady. Better stick to the Brees, Rivers, angle. Packers looking better too. Me thinks Belicheck will do fine without Brady (not as good but ok) because he will scheme/design ways to win based on studying his opponent, something we are not real good at, we often ease into games and try to win the attrition battle.

[K_C_]

....and I'll add that I don't think Mike Tomlin is an elite coach either.

I wouldn't call him a cheerleader. He's a players coach. A motivator.

He's Bill Cowher reincarnated.

I think.

We'll find out a whole lot more when Roethlisberger retires (unless, like Swiss alluded to, Tomlin takes Ben's exit and gets the hell out too).

Wonder how Belichek will fair when Brady hangs it up? How did he do before Brady showed up? How's Sean Payton been doing with his hall of fame QB. How about Mike McCarthy with Favre and Rodgers.

Cowher was damn competitve before Ben showed up.

Neil O'Donnell played in a Super Bowl.

Kordell Stewart finished 3rd in MVP voting one year and played in AFC Championship games.

Neil O'Donnell.

Kordell Stewart.

Christ, Tommy Maddox set Steeler passing records.

[R_S]

....and I'll add that I don't think Mike Tomlin is an elite coach either.

I wouldn't call him a cheerleader. He's a players coach. A motivator.

He's Bill Cowher reincarnated.

I think.

We'll find out a whole lot more when Roethlisberger retires (unless, like Swiss alluded to, Tomlin takes Ben's exit and gets the hell out too).

Wonder how Belichek will fair when Brady hangs it up? How did he do before Brady showed up? How's Sean Payton been doing with his hall of fame QB. How about Mike McCarthy with Favre and Rodgers.

The Pack would have been in another Bowl had it not been a fluke play in the NFCCG. I'd love to even get in another AFCCG.

[blu]

....and I'll add that I don't think Mike Tomlin is an elite coach either.

I wouldn't call him a cheerleader. He's a players coach. A motivator.

He's Bill Cowher reincarnated.

I think.

We'll find out a whole lot more when Roethlisberger retires (unless, like Swiss alluded to, Tomlin takes Ben's exit and gets the hell out too).

Wonder how Belichek will fair when Brady hangs it up? How did he do before Brady showed up? How's Sean Payton been doing with his hall of fame QB. How about Mike McCarthy with Favre and Rodgers.

Cowher was damn competitve before Ben showed up.

Neil O'Donnell played in a Super Bowl.

Kordell Stewart finished 3rd in MVP voting one year and played in AFC Championship games.

Neil O'Donnell.

Kordell Stewart.

Christ, Tommy Maddox set Steeler passing records.

But for Cowher to get through those playoffs & win the SB, he coached like Bizzaro Cowher doing everything the opposite of what he was accustomed to coaching. Cowher was always competitive but too stuck in his ways until that SB run.

[Legacy User]

....and I'll add that I don't think Mike Tomlin is an elite coach either.

I wouldn't call him a cheerleader. He's a players coach. A motivator.

He's Bill Cowher reincarnated.

I think.

We'll find out a whole lot more when Roethlisberger retires (unless, like Swiss alluded to, Tomlin takes Ben's exit and gets the hell out too).

Wonder how Belichek will fair when Brady hangs it up? How did he do before Brady showed up? How's Sean Payton been doing with his hall of fame QB. How about Mike McCarthy with Favre and Rodgers.

Cowher was damn competitve before Ben showed up.

Neil O'Donnell played in a Super Bowl.

Kordell Stewart finished 3rd in MVP voting one year and played in AFC Championship games.

Neil O'Donnell.

Kordell Stewart.

Christ, Tommy Maddox set Steeler passing records.

You might not realize it, but you're making the argument that Cowher actually had decent talent at QB.

Also, didn't the Steelers go 6-10 when Tommy Maddox set his records? Wouldn't you expect a great head coach to capitalize on that and put together, at least, a winning season?

For the record, I liked Cowher and was sad to see him go. I like Tomlin, too. I think they're both very good coaches. Then again, I don't compare them to Noll and Belichick, two guys who are in the conversation for the all time greatest.

[bradshaw2ben]

Belichek won 12 games I think with Matt Cassel and he went 3-1 this year without Brady. Better stick to the Brees, Rivers, angle. Packers looking better too. Me thinks Belicheck will do fine without Brady (not as good but ok) because he will scheme/design ways to win based on studying his opponent, something we are not real good at, we often ease into games and try to win the attrition battle.

49-62
1 postseason in 7 seasons
1-1 playoff record


Elite.

(That's Bill Belichick's career record without Tom Brady.)

[jeemie]

Belichek won 12 games I think with Matt Cassel and he went 3-1 this year without Brady. Better stick to the Brees, Rivers, angle. Packers looking better too. Me thinks Belicheck will do fine without Brady (not as good but ok) because he will scheme/design ways to win based on studying his opponent, something we are not real good at, we often ease into games and try to win the attrition battle.

49-62
1 postseason in 7 seasons
1-1 playoff record


Elite.

(That's Bill Belichick's career record without Tom Brady.)

A lot of that time, he had Art Modell sabotaging him so he could either blackmail Cleveland into giving him a new stadium or else getting ready to move to Baltimore.

[Legacy User]

nothing that happens in Cleveland counts

all those QBs can forever opine that if they didn't have to play for the Clowns they may have been good...

same for coaches and other players

that damn Josh Cribbs could have been an all time great IMO were it not for his jersey....

[Legacy User]

Cowher vs Tomlin is a fun debate. I'd have to say it's damn close to a push.

You can say cowher never had Ben but cowher never had bens salary either. And furthermore cowher didn't want a qb like Ben.

Plus cowher played in the Paleolithic afc central where the greatest threat was well none until Steve McNair showed up.

Anyway tomlins and cowhers strengths and weaknesses just about cancel out imo

[franco>madden]

Not getting into the Chin vs. Aviators debate; they both had/have big upside and both have suffered repeatedly due to apparent limitations . . . although, MT's case isn't closed yet. A nice postseason run now and much would be forgiven. Laying another playoff egg (something Tomlin's and Cowher's teams have done numerous times) will unleash and validate more of Brad's (and this Board's) accusations of well-developed cheerleader/potted plant-ness.

Terry is a public figure and an adult who should be a little more careful. He also has battled depression and other issues and seems to always take the hard road (whether putting his foot in mouth, or not showing up for funerals, or calling out young, dumb Ben, etc.)

BUT, you are nuts if you think Terry Bradshaw has any less rabid love for the Steelers as a football team than anybody here.

Whenever it gets to this time of year and the Stillers are in the hunt, he ALWAYS loudly proclaims his homer-fan status in rooting for the good guys.

I wish Terry would be a little more careful before spouting off, and I will always love #7 and Tomlin, but until either of them is wearing 4 rings, I will give TB the benefit of the doubt as the greatest clutch mofo NFL quarterback of ALL TAHM!!

[StillerDownSouth]

Part of coaching is making adjustments either with personnel or scheme throughout the season, what I mean by this is each year going into camp the coaching staff has an idea of what type of team they think they have, but sometimes through the course of preseason and early season either because of injuries, development or lack of development of young players, or players not performing the coaching staff must make adjustments. This is especially true this year concerning our defense. Through the first 8 games the Steelers were 24 in the league in yards allowed and 16th in points, since then they are #1 in the league in yards allowed and I believe 6th in points allowed. This is a marked improvement on that side of the ball and a big reason we have won 6 in a row. This is not uncommon for Tomlin coached teams as they usually get better as the season advances, which is reflected in his win/loss record the last 3 seasons in December. In less than 3 years the Steelers have totally rebuilt their defense and it looks like they are just a solid edge rusher away from being a dominant unit once again. So in my opinion, this is a reflection of a very good head coach who can develop players and give them a chance for success. Wouldn't it be nice to once again have a dominant defense for the last 5-6 years of Bens career? I believe the steelers are close to accomplishing that, which would set them up nicely for several years.

[Obviously]

Not getting into the Chin vs. Aviators debate; they both had/have big upside and both have suffered repeatedly due to apparent limitations . . . although, MT's case isn't closed yet. A nice postseason run now and much would be forgiven. Laying another playoff egg (something Tomlin's and Cowher's teams have done numerous times) will unleash and validate more of Brad's (and this Board's) accusations of well-developed cheerleader/potted plant-ness.

Terry is a public figure and an adult who should be a little more careful. He also has battled depression and other issues and seems to always take the hard road (whether putting his foot in mouth, or not showing up for funerals, or calling out young, dumb Ben, etc.)

BUT, you are nuts if you think Terry Bradshaw has any less rabid love for the Steelers as a football team than anybody here.

Whenever it gets to this time of year and the Stillers are in the hunt, he ALWAYS loudly proclaims his homer-fan status in rooting for the good guys.

I wish Terry would be a little more careful before spouting off, and I will always love #7 and Tomlin, but until either of them is wearing 4 rings, I will give TB the benefit of the doubt as the greatest clutch mofo NFL quarterback of ALL TAHM!!

This ^^

Sums it up perfectly.

BTW, Tomlin's comments about him being a Dallas fan and specifically a Hollywood Henderson fan, eat a dick, Mikey. I've always been a Pittsburgh Steelers fan, specifically a Franco Harris fan who took the fuckin' rock after Henderson tried his shit in XIII and ran it right down the fuckin' Cowgirls' throats.

Steelers 6 > Cowboys 5 and 2 > 1 head-to-head
Bradshaw 2 > Henderson 0 head-to-head

[Obviously]

Belichek won 12 games I think with Matt Cassel and he went 3-1 this year without Brady. Better stick to the Brees, Rivers, angle. Packers looking better too. Me thinks Belicheck will do fine without Brady (not as good but ok) because he will scheme/design ways to win based on studying his opponent, something we are not real good at, we often ease into games and try to win the attrition battle.

49-62
1 postseason in 7 seasons
1-1 playoff record


Elite.

(That's Bill Belichick's career record without Tom Brady.)

Yeah, but much of that was in Cleveland where even God hates the Browns. Even with God's wrath, he took them to the playoffs in '94 and beat his old boss Parcells. That Cleveland team laid the groundwork for the Ratbirds success later on in the decade. Would like to see your man Mikey T do with the Browns starting in '91 and then having to deal with Modell's announcement the team would move to Baltimore halfway through the '95 season.

[bradshaw2ben]

First off, MTs comments about Henderson came at the end of a measured response to a question and we're not intended to be taken seriously. It was a joke, and was reported as such by people who were there in the room.

[bradshaw2ben]

Secondly, the Browns organization wasn't nearly as bad then as they are since the Ravens split. Sure l, it was Modell-- but Modell had some competitive teams. Belichick's teams were not devoid of talent or organizational support.

[StillerDownSouth]

In the 9 seasons Tomlin has coached in he has 2 AFC championships and 1 Super Bowl, during that same time with sure fire first ballot hall of fame qb while playing in a far inferior division every year, the god of all coaches has 3 AFC chanpionships and 1 super bowl championship that was gifted to him by the worst play call in the 50 year history of the super bowl.

[Obviously]

First off, MTs comments about Henderson came at the end of a measured response to a question and we're not intended to be taken seriously. It was a joke, and was reported as such by people who were there in the room.

Yeah, your take. And I take what the boot-licking Pittsburgh sports media says with a grain of salt. Sorry but Hollywood Henderson's actions prior to and during Super Bowl XIII have earned my scorn forever. Tomlin's use of them to get back at Terry Bradshaw was a poor choice.

[Obviously]

In the 9 seasons Tomlin has coached in he has 2 AFC championships and 1 Super Bowl, during that same time with sure fire first ballot hall of fame qb while playing in a far inferior division every year, the god of all coaches has 3 AFC chanpionships and 1 super bowl championship that was gifted to him by the worst play call in the 50 year history of the super bowl.

You're really trying to compare Tomlin to Belichick? Really? That's fuckin' funny. Okay, let's just go with head-to-head play since 2007

2007: New England 34, Pittsburgh 13
2008: Pittsburgh 33, New England 10 (w/o Brady)
2010: New England 39, Pittsburgh 26
2011: Pittsburgh 25, New England 17
2013: New England 55, Pittsburgh 31 (most points ever scored against a Pittsburgh defense)
2015: New England 28, Pittsburgh 21 (the famous headphones game)
2016: New England 27, Pittsburgh 16 (w/o Ben)

Belichick 5, Tomlin 2

I don't consider Belichick the "god of all coaches". Those are your words. He's definitely in the best in the business today, and with four SB championships, he should be up there in the top 10.

I wish the numbers were switched. I really do. I want Tomlin to be great. I want Tomlin to beat the fuck out of Belichick. What Steeler fan doesn't? He just hasn't shown he can do it. Time to change it. Time to kick ass in the playoffs and get to Foxboro to beat the fuckin' Darth Vader (not god) of football coaches. Or maybe the Richard Nixon as Swiss calls him. Tell you what. If Tomlin does it, I'll keep my avatar for the entire fuckin' year.

[stinger8]

Not getting into the Chin vs. Aviators debate; they both had/have big upside and both have suffered repeatedly due to apparent limitations . . . although, MT's case isn't closed yet. A nice postseason run now and much would be forgiven. Laying another playoff egg (something Tomlin's and Cowher's teams have done numerous times) will unleash and validate more of Brad's (and this Board's) accusations of well-developed cheerleader/potted plant-ness.

Terry is a public figure and an adult who should be a little more careful. He also has battled depression and other issues and seems to always take the hard road (whether putting his foot in mouth, or not showing up for funerals, or calling out young, dumb Ben, etc.)

BUT, you are nuts if you think Terry Bradshaw has any less rabid love for the Steelers as a football team than anybody here.

Whenever it gets to this time of year and the Stillers are in the hunt, he ALWAYS loudly proclaims his homer-fan status in rooting for the good guys.

I wish Terry would be a little more careful before spouting off, and I will always love #7 and Tomlin, but until either of them is wearing 4 rings, I will give TB the benefit of the doubt as the greatest clutch mofo NFL quarterback of ALL TAHM!!

Great post.

[stinger8]

Belichek won 12 games I think with Matt Cassel and he went 3-1 this year without Brady. Better stick to the Brees, Rivers, angle. Packers looking better too. Me thinks Belicheck will do fine without Brady (not as good but ok) because he will scheme/design ways to win based on studying his opponent, something we are not real good at, we often ease into games and try to win the attrition battle.

49-62
1 postseason in 7 seasons
1-1 playoff record


Elite.

(That's Bill Belichick's career record without Tom Brady.)

If there was a discussion of greatest coach in NFL history, Belicheck would be in the conversation along with Noll, Lombardi, Landry, Walsh. Thats my list. Dont think its even debatable. If you are trying to suggest he is a 49-62 esq coach well then I will just shake my head and take the high road BTW Chuck Noll's first 3 seasons he was 1-13, 5-9, and 6-8 Clevlandesque. Still one of the greatest of all time.

[bradshaw2ben]

So, then, you'll agree that just because one is successful with a franchise QB and might not do so well without a franchise QB, he can still be a great coach?

[Legacy User]

So, then, you'll agree that just because one is successful with a franchise QB and might not do so well without a franchise QB, he can still be a great coach?

no

[lifelongsteel]

Belichek won 12 games I think with Matt Cassel and he went 3-1 this year without Brady. Better stick to the Brees, Rivers, angle. Packers looking better too. Me thinks Belicheck will do fine without Brady (not as good but ok) because he will scheme/design ways to win based on studying his opponent, something we are not real good at, we often ease into games and try to win the attrition battle.

49-62
1 postseason in 7 seasons
1-1 playoff record


Elite.

(That's Bill Belichick's career record without Tom Brady.)

If there was a discussion of greatest coach in NFL history, Belicheck would be in the conversation along with Noll, Lombardi, Landry, Walsh. Thats my list. Dont think its even debatable. If you are trying to suggest he is a 49-62 esq coach well then I will just shake my head and take the high road BTW Chuck Noll's first 3 seasons he was 1-13, 5-9, and 6-8 Clevlandesque. Still one of the greatest of all time.

What do those coaches have in common . . . . Brady, Bradshaw, Starr, Staubach, Montana

If you define great coaches by championships, you won't find one that hasn't had a HOF QB.

[StillerDownSouth]

Joe Gibbs and Bill Parcells never had a hof qb

[Thrillsseeker]

So, then, you'll agree that just because one is successful with a franchise QB and might not do so well without a franchise QB, he can still be a great coach?

no

LOL, exactly.

Bill the cheater will always be included in the discussion of greatest coaches of all time etc. Its up to the people to chime in with IF he had never cheated on multiple occasions maybe but for that alone he's disqualified. At which time said people should chime in with sentiments of a cheating fuck, loser, bitch etc at will and also should include robbed Pittsburgh for a chance at another Championship. Fuck Bill Bellicheat. He's a fucking cheater.

[Legacy User]

I was gonna say id add the big Tuna as well, what a staff he put together on the giants. 2 guys by the name of Bill Bellichek and Tom Coughlin.

[lifelongsteel]

Joe Gibbs and Bill Parcells never had a hof qb

Well, they didn't make Stingers list

I think Gibbs belongs on the great coaches list.

Parcells? Overrated imo. He's more on the level with a Cowher or Tomlin.

[Donnie Brasco]

Joe Gibbs and Bill Parcells never had a hof qb

Well, they didn't make Stingers list

I think Gibbs belongs on the great coaches list.

Parcells? Overrated imo. He's more on the level with a Cowher or Tomlin.

Honestly has Parcells won anything without Belicheck on his staff? So agree that Parcells probably belongs in the really good category and not great