Rams at Steelers Game Thread Comments & Chat

[COR-TEN]

Can’t make that play call in that situation. Just can’t. Rudolph has not shown the ability to feel the rush coming and get rid of the ball. That’s a fail by fichtner

Bullshit. He had zero time to react.

Re: the safety... He had more than enough time to get the ball out and should have known he had a short clock. That on was on Rudolph.

From what I can see from the replay, he had three guys going down field, a fourth on a delay (who I think was the intended target, while the others cleared out some space0, and none were looking back for the ball. All four were between the hashes, so he couldn't just chuck it out of bounds. I counted 3 - 3.5 seconds before donald was bearing down on him. So if anything, the play call was bad taking too long to develop?

[LakecrestSteeler]

Minkah Fitzburgh!!!!!!

[the-other-burg]

Tomlins guy is Edmunds. Ironically the other edmunds has more defensive takeways this season.

Tomlin's guy is also Haden, Watt, Hargrave, Heyward, Dupree, & Cam Sutton

Yeah but we like them and it does not play into the narrative

Sorry, I thought we were talking about 1st round safeties. We picked Edmunds - whose dogshit, and has less takeaways on D then a RB that goes by the same name. And Haden was a free agent signing as well. No narrative, the truth.

[Steelafan77]

That's my point B2B. As evidenced by the lack of any real running game. If they had any semblance of running game they wouldn't have to just run for show as you put it. They would've been running to close out the end game. Get one first down running the ball was all they had to do...

[bradshaw2ben]

That's my point B2B. As evidenced by the lack of any real running game. If they had any semblance of running game they wouldn't have to just run for show as you put it. They would've been running to close out the end game. Get one first down running the ball was all they had to do...

They haven't had a close it out running game for like three years now. It's been slowly deteriorating as Ben threw more short passes, Bell got older, the OL lost Munchak, and Ben is out completely. Don't underestimate how much Ben trying to put them in more favorable run situations helps and don't underestimate how much the threat of Ben creates running lanes. We don't really have a RB who can create his own holes, even when Conner is healthy, so more things have to work together to get it going, especially vs a strong run defense like LAR's.

But sometimes, running for show is enough in the NFL.

[bradshaw2ben]

Tomlin's guy is also Haden, Watt, Hargrave, Heyward, Dupree, & Cam Sutton

Yeah but we like them and it does not play into the narrative

Sorry, I thought we were talking about 1st round safeties. We picked Edmunds - whose dogshit, and has less takeaways on D then a RB that goes by the same name. And Haden was a free agent signing as well. No narrative, the truth.

Haden came because Tomlin pushed for it and also because Tomlin loved Haden coming out. Just didn't fall right for them that year.

Edmunds might be one of the three lesser players on this defense right now, but he is far, far from dogshit. He made 2-3 excellent plays yesterday. I thought the PI was borderline at best and at minimum Edmunds has shown progress now that his role has been simplified. Part of Minkah being great so far is Edmunds doing well enough to allow Minkah the freedom to roam and make plays. Whatever Edmunds' perceived flaws, you can't take that away from him.

[LakecrestSteeler]

Yeah but we like them and it does not play into the narrative

Sorry, I thought we were talking about 1st round safeties. We picked Edmunds - whose dogshit, and has less takeaways on D then a RB that goes by the same name. And Haden was a free agent signing as well. No narrative, the truth.

Haden came because Tomlin pushed for it and also because Tomlin loved Haden coming out. Just didn't fall right for them that year.

Edmunds might be one of the three lesser players on this defense right now, but he is far, far from dogshit. He made 2-3 excellent plays yesterday. I thought the PI was borderline at best and at minimum Edmunds has shown progress now that his role has been simplified. Part of Minkah being great so far is Edmunds doing well enough to allow Minkah the freedom to roam and make plays. Whatever Edmunds' perceived flaws, you can't take that away from him.

I will take OPI every time if it is lees than 15 yards, which I believe it was, and you are on the receiver like white on rice.

[jeemie]

Bullshit. He had zero time to react.

Re: the safety... He had more than enough time to get the ball out and should have known he had a short clock. That on was on Rudolph.

From what I can see from the replay, he had three guys going down field, a fourth on a delay (who I think was the intended target, while the others cleared out some space0, and none were looking back for the ball. All four were between the hashes, so he couldn't just chuck it out of bounds. I counted 3 - 3.5 seconds before donald was bearing down on him. So if anything, the play call was bad taking too long to develop?

Exactly.

There was nowhere and no time for MR to chuck it.

To have done so would have been to invite a disastrous interception.

Bad play call and design and zero blocking from OL.

[COR-TEN]

Re: the safety... He had more than enough time to get the ball out and should have known he had a short clock. That on was on Rudolph.

From what I can see from the replay, he had three guys going down field, a fourth on a delay (who I think was the intended target, while the others cleared out some space0, and none were looking back for the ball. All four were between the hashes, so he couldn't just chuck it out of bounds. I counted 3 - 3.5 seconds before donald was bearing down on him. So if anything, the play call was bad taking too long to develop?

Exactly.

There was nowhere and no time for MR to chuck it.

To have done so would have been to invite a disastrous interception.

Bad play call and design and zero blocking from OL.

Listen to the MR presser. They actually wanted to go deep to Holton. Fuck me dead. WTF does fichtner always think going deep from your own end zone is a good idea? It works what, > 10% of the time. AND MR said he didn't want to pull the trigger because he had. . . pocket presence and figured give them 2 instead of 7.

[Steelafan77]

Well with no threat of a run game [for over 3 years] and the likeliness of them looking to throw the bomb as per the Ben/Randy standard what else did we really expect? That was a trainwreck waiting to happen... Both predictable and unprepared to scheme themselves out of their own endzone they played right into the defenses advantage...

I have only one question. Why did it have to be that fucking asshat mathews? The predictable way this offense is schemed made mathews look all pro and he's been wash up almost out of the league.

[Donnie Brasco]

Don't get me wrong, I really hate Tomlin but I get his thinking with the play action:
a) He knows the Rams are gonna send the house, so they're banking on buying time with PA
b) Rudolph has been pretty good at play action
c) Great opportunity to flip the field- high likelihood of getting zero coverage

I'm more irritated with Rudolph who has the pocket sense of Kent Graham at the moment. He has zero internal clock or awareness of the rush. That's 2 consecutive safeties on his resume

[COR-TEN]

Don't get me wrong, I really hate Tomlin but I get his thinking with the play action:
a) He knows the Rams are gonna send the house, so they're banking on buying time with PA
b) Rudolph has been pretty good at play action
c) Great opportunity to flip the field- high likelihood of getting zero coverage

I'm more irritated with Rudolph who has the pocket sense of Kent Graham at the moment. He has zero internal clock or awareness of the rush. That's 2 consecutive safeties on his resume

That would have worked with a bigger, stronger QB, and AB. Neither of which they have now. AND with a weaker coached O line.

Anybody remember the INT from the end zone in the SB vs the Packers?

Dumb. Low percentage play. Move the sticks, gawd damnit!

[Steelafan77]

That scenario would have taken a herculean effort from a run game that was effective all day which was not the case. Should have just kneeled down and taken the safety if that was their approach.

[COR-TEN]

That scenario would have taken a herculean effort from a run game that was effective all day which was not the case. Should have just kneeled down and taken the safety if that was their approach.

I'm talking about a five step drop and a dump off to a crosser around the 7 yard line in three seconds. Breathing space. Pats do that all the time. Then go for the bomb on second and 5.

[Steelafan77]

Ten, stop making football sense... that's just not applicable when discussing the Steelers and their game plans...

[Jobu]

That scenario would have taken a herculean effort from a run game that was effective all day which was not the case. Should have just kneeled down and taken the safety if that was their approach.

I'm talking about a five step drop and a dump off to a crosser around the 7 yard line in three seconds. Breathing space. Pats do that all the time. Then go for the bomb on second and 5.

Yep...makes sense.

[bradshaw2ben]

From what I can see from the replay, he had three guys going down field, a fourth on a delay (who I think was the intended target, while the others cleared out some space0, and none were looking back for the ball. All four were between the hashes, so he couldn't just chuck it out of bounds. I counted 3 - 3.5 seconds before donald was bearing down on him. So if anything, the play call was bad taking too long to develop?

Exactly.

There was nowhere and no time for MR to chuck it.

To have done so would have been to invite a disastrous interception.

Bad play call and design and zero blocking from OL.

Listen to the MR presser. They actually wanted to go deep to Holton. Fuck me dead. WTF does fichtner always think going deep from your own end zone is a good idea? It works what, > 10% of the time. AND MR said he didn't want to pull the trigger because he had. . . pocket presence and figured give them 2 instead of 7.

That's some bullshit. Throw it away to grass, then, take you chances with a intentional grounding call rather than be sacked and maybe lose the football. besides, he had Vance McDonald right in front of him, just took too long to come off the deep ball.

[steelmann58]

Terrible all around Bad play calling and excoution

[COR-TEN]

If you're arguing MR should have taken the intentional grounding penalty instead of the safety then I'm all on board with that.

You just made it seem like he had guys open and it was a lack of ability to see the field/pocket presence. What you describe is a lack of mental acumen. Kid is young. I give him the benefit of the doubt, but he reacted well enough under pressure. He's not a seasoned vet. So he made the second best choice. I'd rather have MR than Dobbs or Jones, for sure.

[El Kabong]

If you're arguing MR should have taken the intentional grounding penalty instead of the safety then I'm all on board with that.

You just made it seem like he had guys open and it was a lack of ability to see the field/pocket presence. What you describe is a lack of mental acumen. Kid is young. I give him the benefit of the doubt, but he reacted well enough under pressure. He's not a seasoned vet. So he made the second best choice. I'd rather have MR than Dobbs or Jones, for sure.

Intentional grounding penalty in the end zone is a safety.

[COR-TEN]

If you're arguing MR should have taken the intentional grounding penalty instead of the safety then I'm all on board with that.

You just made it seem like he had guys open and it was a lack of ability to see the field/pocket presence. What you describe is a lack of mental acumen. Kid is young. I give him the benefit of the doubt, but he reacted well enough under pressure. He's not a seasoned vet. So he made the second best choice. I'd rather have MR than Dobbs or Jones, for sure.

Intentional grounding penalty in the end zone is a safety.

I'd forgotten about that. Thanks for the correction. And B2B is a ref?

[Donnie Brasco]

Don't get me wrong, I really hate Tomlin but I get his thinking with the play action:
a) He knows the Rams are gonna send the house, so they're banking on buying time with PA
b) Rudolph has been pretty good at play action
c) Great opportunity to flip the field- high likelihood of getting zero coverage

I'm more irritated with Rudolph who has the pocket sense of Kent Graham at the moment. He has zero internal clock or awareness of the rush. That's 2 consecutive safeties on his resume

That would have worked with a bigger, stronger QB, and AB. Neither of which they have now. AND with a weaker coached O line.

Anybody remember the INT from the end zone in the SB vs the Packers?

Dumb. Low percentage play. Move the sticks, gawd damnit!

But then everyone would skewer MT for "being too conservative". Can't have it both ways.
Again, not a Tomlin guy and never will be but I cannot stand hypocrites

9:49 of the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnfGEDH ... =emb_title

I count 3.5 secs from snap to sack

9:51 he has MacDonald (or Vannett) crossing and he can easily throw it into his feet OR he can side arm it into Samuels ass, as he hasn't turned around

If this is anywhere BUT the EZ, then yes I can acknowledge Rudolph has to eat this one

But again, this is the 2nd safety in a row. He's responsible for getting the football out so he doesn't give up points. There's no other way to slice it.

[Jobu]

I count 3.5 secs from snap to sack

Just stop. It was play action...by the time his back foot hits and he gets his head around, he has about a second or less to process...
Blaming Rudolph for the safety is nitpicking at its finest. He had no chance there.

[bradshaw2ben]

If you're arguing MR should have taken the intentional grounding penalty instead of the safety then I'm all on board with that.

You just made it seem like he had guys open and it was a lack of ability to see the field/pocket presence. What you describe is a lack of mental acumen. Kid is young. I give him the benefit of the doubt, but he reacted well enough under pressure. He's not a seasoned vet. So he made the second best choice. I'd rather have MR than Dobbs or Jones, for sure.

He had Mcdonald directly in front of him with a throwing lane. He just stuck with the 1st read way too long. Also, One problem is Rudolph's release is very long right now, so even when he sees it and wants to throw, it is taking an extra instant for the ball to come out. But literally he could have thrown it at Mcdonald's feet before rush got there, had he the pocket awareness to realize he's in the EZ and the play's not there.

[bradshaw2ben]

If you're arguing MR should have taken the intentional grounding penalty instead of the safety then I'm all on board with that.

You just made it seem like he had guys open and it was a lack of ability to see the field/pocket presence. What you describe is a lack of mental acumen. Kid is young. I give him the benefit of the doubt, but he reacted well enough under pressure. He's not a seasoned vet. So he made the second best choice. I'd rather have MR than Dobbs or Jones, for sure.

Intentional grounding penalty in the end zone is a safety.

I'd forgotten about that. Thanks for the correction. And B2B is a ref?

What I suggested is that he *risk* intentional grounding penalty safety over a surefire safety or worse by holding the ball. If he throws it in Mcdonald's general direction, it's not going to be called intentional grounding.

[Orangesteel]

His progressions are slow and his release is slow. He made better throws in the Rams game but he’s still playing too timid.

I argue that the self-inflicted turnovers:

- Moncrief’s tip drill INT
- JJSS tip drill INT
- crucial fumbles by JJSS, Conner, Washington, Johnson in the Cincy game

...could very well be fucking with his psyche. He’s being told to protect the football, which is the right message, but unfortunately that message isn’t getting through to the other guys. We need to play clean football. We haven’t played clean football in years. It’s time to start doing that and we have a chance to make the playoffs.

[Donnie Brasco]

I count 3.5 secs from snap to sack

Just stop. It was play action...by the time his back foot hits and he gets his head around, he has about a second or less to process...
Blaming Rudolph for the safety is nitpicking at its finest. He had no chance there.

I didn't say the throw was going to be a good one, nor do I expect him to fully plant his feet to release the ball, but it HAS to come out. If they rule IG then whatever...you roll with it.

But that's 2 safeties in a row now

[bradshaw2ben]

I count 3.5 secs from snap to sack

Just stop. It was play action...by the time his back foot hits and he gets his head around, he has about a second or less to process...
Blaming Rudolph for the safety is nitpicking at its finest. He had no chance there.

I didn't say the throw was going to be a good one, nor do I expect him to fully plant his feet to release the ball, but it HAS to come out. If they rule IG then whatever...you roll with it.

But that's 2 safeties in a row now

I was screaming LET IT GO at the top of my lungs, because I have a clock in my head. How is it possible he, a reasonably competent and occasionally very good QB doesn't have that same clock? You make the play fake, you turn your head to see the 1st read, you either let it fly trying to make the play, or you throw it deep and out of bounds, or (if you're on the NFL QB mental clock wavelength) maybe you throw it at the feet of the TE who is 10 yards in front of you when you come off your 1st read after 1 second.

[COR-TEN]

Just stop. It was play action...by the time his back foot hits and he gets his head around, he has about a second or less to process...
Blaming Rudolph for the safety is nitpicking at its finest. He had no chance there.

I didn't say the throw was going to be a good one, nor do I expect him to fully plant his feet to release the ball, but it HAS to come out. If they rule IG then whatever...you roll with it.

But that's 2 safeties in a row now

I was screaming LET IT GO at the top of my lungs, because I have a clock in my head. How is it possible he, a reasonably competent and occasionally very good QB doesn't have that same clock? You make the play fake, you turn your head to see the 1st read, you either let it fly trying to make the play, or you throw it deep and out of bounds, or (if you're on the NFL QB mental clock wavelength) maybe you throw it at the feet of the TE who is 10 yards in front of you when you come off your 1st read after 1 second.

You've been watching football for longer than MR has been alive. I agree with Jobu. Sure, he had a chance to let it go. A very small chance. A split second.

[bradshaw2ben]

CORE, that's what NFL QB's do that separates them from mortals: they make these decisions in split seconds. The difference between a guy who makes the decision in 1.5 seconds and one who does it in .7 seconds is the street <--> Pro Bowl