First Post: The more things change, the more things stay the

[bradshaw2ben]

welcome aboard

Playing more press with these CBs and the rules as presently enforced is a recipe for disaster. Playing off man and C3 probably reduces the amount of opportunities for 5 yards and an automatic first down.

The coverage underneath is bad but so little of that is the fault of the outside CBs or the slot guy for that matter. Ryan Shazier has little to no idea of how to play zone coverage in the NFL or as part of this defense. When you have hook/curl under responsibility, you can't bail 15-20 yards downfield and let completions gash your D underneath. You have to be aware of what's in your area and what the offense is trying to do from their formation vs your D. Those little seam routes will kill this defense, especially if the pass rush is this abysmal/late and even more so if we go to a 4-3 Cover 2 look (we don't have the FS population for that, anyway).

[Steelperch]

They do mix in press man coverage. Two big problems: they don't have the talent on the back end to run it effectively & with the new rules enforcement it would just result in a slew of flags. They've already thrown more than triple the amount of PI & defensive holding flags this preseason vs last preseason.

The biggest issue starts up front. They can't stop the run which puts them behind schedule. Their only solution to that major issue from last year was to draft an ILB that has trouble getting off blocks and bringing back a 36 year old DE for 2 more seasons.

[Steelafan77]

If we're going by the current roster I'd go with...




Mauro Tuitt Heyward Worilds

RDE NT UT LDE



ROLB MLB LOLB

Shazier Timmons Zumwalt

That still leaves a less than desirable secondary. Mitchell so far is a detriment to this defense. Ike is constantly nit picked for "tactics" and is flagged every other play. CB depth is of great concern. Fix the secondary and most of the defense in place now could work. JMO

[Legacy User]

No defense can be successful without a pass rush. It makes it very hard to get turnovers or get off the field on third downs, even third and a long distance. Jervis does not look like he has the physical tools to rush the passer and if he doesn't, the defense will continue to get picked apart.

[Legacy User]

I believe that no scheme will work or be very effective if you don't play it with a certain attitude or attack mentality. Too often our defense seems to be on its heels rather than on their toes and playing downhill.

[Old School Steeler]

welcome aboard

Playing more press with these CBs and the rules as presently enforced is a recipe for disaster. Playing off man and C3 probably reduces the amount of opportunities for 5 yards and an automatic first down.

The coverage underneath is bad but so little of that is the fault of the outside CBs or the slot guy for that matter. Ryan Shazier has little to no idea of how to play zone coverage in the NFL or as part of this defense. When you have hook/curl under responsibility, you can't bail 15-20 yards downfield and let completions gash your D underneath. You have to be aware of what's in your area and what the offense is trying to do from their formation vs your D. Those little seam routes will kill this defense, especially if the pass rush is this abysmal/late and even more so if we go to a 4-3 Cover 2 look (we don't have the FS population for that, anyway).

cool reply brother, a little press though? Mix it up?

While watching yet another spread offense shred us last night, only this one is specifically designed to destroy our style of defense with the results even more ideal given our lack of talent it is apparent to me that the first order of business should be get the damn QB.

That's on the short term, on the long term is the greater concern that any connection to what has been Steeler football since Chuck has been lost and like many I'm disgusted. We went from tough to pussy in a sport where tough is one of the requirements for success. Even during the valley of the 80's Chuck was on the sideline, the connection was there. Cowher was a Pittsburgh guy who said he'd get back to Steeler football and Lloyd's defense was championship caliber. Maybe the connection to Chuck would have continued with Grimm, but hiring an outsider like Tomlin who loves splash players is proving to be a disconnect. Jones' splash plays at GA were the product of that system, bangers like Ogletree did the grunt work while Jones got the glory, so we drafted the glory. Watching Jones get tossed around last night was pitiful.

Maybe last night was a total aberration and maybe my theory is bullshit, or maybe a combination of both. The longer anything is disconnected from its roots the harder to reconnect. Thanks Mike, Pittsburgh tough to Pittsburgh pussy.

[Legacy User]

I believe that no scheme will work or be very effective if you don't play it with a certain attitude or attack mentality. Too often our defense seems to be on its heels rather than on their toes and playing downhill.

The bend but don't break lol

Pretty much, I mean there are times when bend but don't break are appropriate and but I prefer to dictate rather than be reactionary.

[955876]

designed to destroy our style of defense with the results even more ideal given our lack of talent

Our front 7 is comprised of FOUR first rounders and 2 second rounders.

6 of 7 high pics.

If we are lacking talent then those in charge of that need to be shown the door.

Pronto...

[Legacy User]

I know this was only a preseason game, but if we lose against the stains week one i think Tomlin is done.

I wonder whether he'd lose the locker room if this happens. But there are a lot of new faces, so hard to say. Ben, Heath, Ike, Beard, Troy. I wonder what those guys are thinking. Troy looked disgusted.

[Steelafan77]

Was anyone able to actually see Troy's alleged melt down last night? I was not. I heard it spoke of by the Steelers commentating crew. For Troy to come undone is unusual. I'd like to see what was going on. I'll have to go back and watch the DVR'd NFLN version to see if I can find anything.

[955876]

Spare yourself the time. This team isn't worthy of being watched more than once.

[Legacy User]

Was anyone able to actually see Troy's alleged melt down last night? I was not. I heard it spoke of by the Steelers commentating crew. For Troy to come undone is unusual. I'd like to see what was going on. I'll have to go back and watch the DVR'd NFLN version to see if I can find anything.

I just saw him looking disgusted on the bench. Did not look like a happy camper. I don't know about a melt down. Sounds very un-Troy-like.

[Legacy User]

Steelers are getting hammered with flags with the DB's 10 yards off because they insist on grabbing the WR as the WR make their first move (that is unless of course they take the free 7 yard route for the easy pitch and catch).

If we are going to get flags, I'd rather they be because our guys jammed them and held on too long, at least the timing would be off.

Problem is - I don't think we have guys good enough to do even that.

[Legacy User]

If Tomlin does not change the psyche of our corners to press / man up he is gone this year.

If you comb your hair back, have a law degree and have a last name of Rooney then perhaps your statement has some substance. Otherwise i wouldn't bet on it. The only way Tomlin gets canned before '16 is if he's doing something Jeff Reed-ish in public... in just his briefs.
If you will.

[Legacy User]

Was anyone able to actually see Troy's alleged melt down last night? I was not. I heard it spoke of by the Steelers commentating crew. For Troy to come undone is unusual. I'd like to see what was going on. I'll have to go back and watch the DVR'd NFLN version to see if I can find anything.

I just saw him looking disgusted on the bench. Did not look like a happy camper. I don't know about a melt down. Sounds very un-Troy-like.

On the touchdown run just before - he made a bee line for the QB, let the ball carrier go right past. I think Lebeau chewed him out for that, although as he came off - they showed he and lebeau talking on the sidelines. No blow up, just Troy nodding his head.

The blow up came when the entire defense was gathered around Lebeau - my guess is he challenged everyones desire, heart, etc... and Troy took exception - I'm guessing because he felt he was playing hard.

[lifelongsteel]

How about we just play a 3-4 D the way it's supposed to be played.

I am now in full agreement with Ziv that the D has fully gone from a LeBeau classic 3-4 D to a Tomlin run-in-hit 3-4 package D.

I thought the package shit would go away once we found a full time ILB to put next to Timmons. Looks like i was wrong.

[Legacy User]

I like the idea of disrupting routes at the line more often...but the problems are much more talent related then scheme related.

We played 4 man fronts over 60% of the time last year, and a bunch this year so far. Fact is they get there ass kicked vs the run. Looks more and more like the reason Heyward never started until last year was he sucks vs the run. Thomas was slightly better. People have to come to terms with the personnel is this bad. I'm looking more at Heyward, Timmons, and Mitchell then Shaz, Jones, or Tuitt.

I thought the calls in the secondary were bullshit.

[stillcajun]

With the exception of Gay, I believe our CB's overall are better at press than zone. Ike has been playing the same way for 11+ yrs and now because of last year Super Bowl and the crying of Peyton and co, every touch past 5 yds is being called a penalty. If that's the way they're going to call it I say tell them to hit the weight room and build up the upper body strength and then proceed to mug every WR within 5yds of the LOS. And I mean jam them big time not this put 1 hand on them and then run w/ them crap. I mean old school, two-handed, everything short of punching them type jams at the LOS.

I would rather have the illegal contact on 1st and 2nd than get to 3rd and long, make the play to stop them and get off the field, only for the drive to be extended due to some ticky-tacky holding/PI/illegal contact. That is plain disheartening and you could see it on the guys face like WTF are we supposed to do when you call that crap.

Watching what was going on last night was just plain horrible, yeah the run D sucked but I think that had more to do with thinking than actually playing. They ran a lot out of passing formations and it was confusing the crap outta them. If teams are going to do that to them then they need to go w/ the "blitz the run on the way to the QB" mentality.

Sad part is that you still have to have the horses to do that as well...

[Jobu]

Something smells Switzy to me.

[Legacy User]

How about we just play a 3-4 D the way it's supposed to be played.

I am now in full agreement with Ziv that the D has fully gone from a LeBeau classic 3-4 D to a Tomlin run-in-hit 3-4 package D.
I thought the package shit would go away once we found a full time ILB to put next to Timmons. Looks like i was wrong.

I agree with that too.

Doesn't seem to be any longer about discipline, more about speed.

[alancac98]

How about we just play a 3-4 D the way it's supposed to be played.

I am now in full agreement with Ziv that the D has fully gone from a LeBeau classic 3-4 D to a Tomlin run-in-hit 3-4 package D.
I thought the package shit would go away once we found a full time ILB to put next to Timmons. Looks like i was wrong.

I agree with that too.

Doesn't seem to be any longer about discipline, more about speed.

Tomlin is the new AlDavis and has turned this team into the new Oakland - speed and athleticism before football players!

[Legacy User]

How about we just play a 3-4 D the way it's supposed to be played.

I am now in full agreement with Ziv that the D has fully gone from a LeBeau classic 3-4 D to a Tomlin run-in-hit 3-4 package D.
I thought the package shit would go away once we found a full time ILB to put next to Timmons. Looks like i was wrong.

I agree with that too.

Doesn't seem to be any longer about discipline, more about speed.

Tomlin is the new AlDavis and has turned this team into the new Oakland - speed and athleticism before football players!

Are you suggesting that Shazier isn't a football player? Reason I ask is that it's well known that he's one of the "fast players" we've added.

[lifelongsteel]

I thought the problem all along was that we had football players but no speed?

[Legacy User]

Something smells Switzy to me.

Ewwwww

[Jobu]

Something smells Switzy to me.

Ewwwww

As a lurker around these parts and only recently a poster I am not Switzy, admin can check that... Your no detective son!

Lebeau's kryptonite has always been the spread offense. Zone principles mostly will never defeat it consistently. Man up, press and disrupt timing, Lebeau won't change now.

And there's the usual Switz denial. You're as predictable as the sunrise.

[V DUB]

1st order of buisness is the division, none of which run the spread, aside from a future JF lead Browns team.

2nd is conference, which the AFC seems to be sceptical of the spread/option.

Building your team to defend opponents that you see twice in 4 years seems counterproductive. I'd wait until I saw them in the SB while building a team that can actually get there to worry about it. 9 times out of 10 a familiar conference foe is going to knock them out of the tournament anyway.

[bradshaw2ben]

2nd is conference, which the AFC seems to be sceptical of the spread/option.

You mean except for Denver, who is wholehertedly running it and New England, who more or less is running a version of the spread?

[V DUB]

I think if we see NE in either of out recent SB years, we're still at #4.

It's about matchups & if you dont win vs the majority, you dont have a shot.

[Legacy User]

This thread should be titled cognitive dissonance.

Spread, spread, blah, blah, fucking blah...there WR's had about 75 yards at the half. On the other hand they averaged over 5 a carry...

[V DUB]

I agree with Ziv here, stopping the run in the AFCN is priority #1...that gets you to the dance. Tendencies, matchups, familiarity will advance your team.

Im not getting hung up on this loss because its preseason & an out of conference team. We had much the same problems when we saw them in '08. Thank God we didnt run into that buzz saw in the SB.