Sounds like Watt is being shopped

[.Kodiak]

I also keep thinking about how poor this team’s post season success has been and wonder if Watt himself wants to go to a true contender.

It's almost impossible not to believe. I get you're raising a family here and you plan to stay. But there's no way you want to continue grinding for Mediocre Mike with little to no hope of ever winning a playoff game, much less a championship.

Honestly, if TJ doesn't want out of this shit show then I seriously wonder about his desire to win. And I also can't get that story about him not wanting to move around out of my head. I question his heart.

[.Kodiak]

Watt will be expensive.

PIT can do a sign-and-trade and absorb a large SB, making Watt very affordable to a new team.

[K_C_]

The Steelers are in a real jam with TJ because I'll say it again: While Tomlin might be retarded, Kahn isn't.

They are caught between wanting to fight for the NHALS (they aren't built for a deep playoff run with a 42 year old QB, being in the same conference with Mahomes, Allen, Lamar, Burrow and Bo Nix (who we're lucky we saw last year starting one of his first NFL games. Dude is gonna be a stud.) I also expect Drake Maye to show a bunch of improvement this year and for New England to surprise. Herbert, who can't seem to win when it matters, is still one helluva talent. Justin Fields can win in NYC with that supporting cast. It wouldn't shock me if Miami finished in last place in that division, especially knowing Tua won't finish this season healthy.

If Kahn is getting serious offers like 2 1's for Watt or a 1 and a 2, he has to seriously think about moving Watt even if Tomlin doesn't want to.

The Steelers ARE, unless Will Howard somehow ends up looking like the next John Unitas, which is unlikely to say the least, they ARE going to draft their (hopefully) franchise QB in the first round of the 2026 draft. Being that Tomlin never finishes under .500 and he probably won't be under .500 this year, the Steelers are going to need draft capital to go up and get their guy.

Trading Watt gives them the necessary capital to move up into the top 10, or possibly even the top 5. If they don't trade Watt, they'll be picking in the 16-20 range and they will not have enough assets to get somewhat of a sure thing (if there is one of those in today's modern NFL.)

If TJ is re-signed to a massive deal, the Steelers are going to have to hope for a Bo Nix or Jordan Love type situation playing out.

[gojira5150]

If TJ is re-signed to a massive deal, the Steelers are going to have to hope for a Bo Nix or Jordan Love type situation playing out.

This could be Taylen Green. Hopefully he slips into that 17-23 range.

[steelmann58]

If the right deal it should looked into

[anpsteel]

IF Watt is really complaining that the signing of these other players are taking away dollars that could be used to sign him...

well fuck that noise, and trade him away


Also, the way the numbers are set up- this will almost certainly need to be a 5 year deal, with the back end being just for the purposes of spreading out the cap hit.

The Steelers are in a no-win situation with Watt, imo.

Don't pay him, and you'll get the negative blow-back from the player and the locker room.

Sign him, and you've chained yourself, at a huge cap hit, for a rapidly depreciating asset for several seasons.

[StillerDownSouth]

Trading Watt to Carolina or some other shitty team would be ideal.

[K_C_]

Trading Watt to Carolina or some other shitty team would be ideal.

Watt isn’t Pickens or Diontae Johnson. He’s been a model Steeler and a superstar who will be a first ballot Hall of Famer. No reason to fuck him over on the way out.

Sure you want to get great compensation for TJ but if I’m Kahn, I’m first talking to Green Bay, Detroit and Washington providing those teams are interested and I’m betting they are.

Watt’s been a great, great player for the Steelers. I would send him to a contender if I possibly could.

[955876]

Trading Watt to Carolina or some other shitty team would be ideal.

A shitty team likely doesn’t do that deal though.

[CoolShades]

Trading Watt to Carolina or some other shitty team would be ideal.

Watt isn’t Pickens or Diontae Johnson. He’s been a model Steeler and a superstar who will be a first ballot Hall of Famer. No reason to fuck him over on the way out.

Sure you want to get great compensation for TJ but if I’m Kahn, I’m first talking to Green Bay, Detroit and Washington providing those teams are interested and I’m betting they are.

Watt’s been a great, great player for the Steelers. I would send him to a contender if I possibly could.

Nah. This is business. You take the best deal, regardless of where it sends Watt.

He has no problem holding out on the Steelers. I have no problem trading him to Carolina, GB, or anywhere in the league.

I take the best deal with the team that is looking like it will finish with the fewest wins. All ties go to the garbage franchise. If it fucks him over in the process, so be it.

Watt is one of the biggest problems on this team. He won’t say a bad word about his beloved Coach. If he had a strong desire to win, he would have opened his mouth years ago. He wants his money and his stats. That’s what he cares about. Winning is at least 3rd on his priority list, and I’d bet it’s even lower than that.

We have Corporate Cam the Company Man and Corporate Watt the Company Twat.

[955876]

Nah. This is business. You take the best deal, regardless of where it sends Watt.

Yes but a team with serious SB aspirations would likely give you the best deal.

A shitty team likely to het a top pick anyways would be dumb to trade away for an aging player.

Detroit etc would/should absolutely do that deal.

[955876]

We have Corporate Cam the Company Man and Corporate Watt the Company Twat.

So true.

[K_C_]

Trading Watt to Carolina or some other shitty team would be ideal.

Watt isn’t Pickens or Diontae Johnson. He’s been a model Steeler and a superstar who will be a first ballot Hall of Famer. No reason to fuck him over on the way out.

Sure you want to get great compensation for TJ but if I’m Kahn, I’m first talking to Green Bay, Detroit and Washington providing those teams are interested and I’m betting they are.

Watt’s been a great, great player for the Steelers. I would send him to a contender if I possibly could.

Nah. This is business. You take the best deal, regardless of where it sends Watt.

He has no problem holding out on the Steelers. I have no problem trading him to Carolina, GB, or anywhere in the league.

I take the best deal with the team that is looking like it will finish with the fewest wins. All ties go to the garbage franchise. If it fucks him over in the process, so be it.

Watt is one of the biggest problems on this team. He won’t say a bad word about his beloved Coach. If he had a strong desire to win, he would have opened his mouth years ago. He wants his money and his stats. That’s what he cares about. Winning is at least 3rd on his priority list, and I’d bet it’s even lower than that.

We have Corporate Cam the Company Man and Corporate Watt the Company Twat.

That’s just not how this works.

Ben Roethlisberger was a 2 time Super Bowl champion and take all the time you need to show me specific quotes of Ben being critical of Mikey T. You know, while Ben was still playing for the Steelers.

Again take all the time you need.

TJ Watt has more than done his part to help the Steelers win. He’s a legendary Steeler but much like the second half of Ben’s career, Watt been hamstrung by by an overrated coach and playing for an organization that every year has major holes springing leaks somewhere. Towards the end of Ben’s career, the o-line and secondary were a joke (especially at corner.) Since Ben left, the Steelers have obviously had major issues at QB, WR and inside linebacker after Shazier’s devastating injury:

Watt has been great and has given his all, just like Ben (who never bitched even when he wasn’t allowed to audible!) TJ conducted himself like a pro every game, no matter what.

You try to help your team and a longtime cornerstone player if you’re looking to move on. No reason to fuck a guy like Watt over. He’s been a pleasure to watch from day one.

[steelmann58]

You still listen to any offer

[CoolShades]

Watt isn’t Pickens or Diontae Johnson. He’s been a model Steeler and a superstar who will be a first ballot Hall of Famer. No reason to fuck him over on the way out.

Sure you want to get great compensation for TJ but if I’m Kahn, I’m first talking to Green Bay, Detroit and Washington providing those teams are interested and I’m betting they are.

Watt’s been a great, great player for the Steelers. I would send him to a contender if I possibly could.

Nah. This is business. You take the best deal, regardless of where it sends Watt.

He has no problem holding out on the Steelers. I have no problem trading him to Carolina, GB, or anywhere in the league.

I take the best deal with the team that is looking like it will finish with the fewest wins. All ties go to the garbage franchise. If it fucks him over in the process, so be it.

Watt is one of the biggest problems on this team. He won’t say a bad word about his beloved Coach. If he had a strong desire to win, he would have opened his mouth years ago. He wants his money and his stats. That’s what he cares about. Winning is at least 3rd on his priority list, and I’d bet it’s even lower than that.

We have Corporate Cam the Company Man and Corporate Watt the Company Twat.

That’s just not how this works.

Ben Roethlisberger was a 2 time Super Bowl champion and take all the time you need to show me specific quotes of Ben being critical of Mikey T. You know, while Ben was still playing for the Steelers.

Again take all the time you need.

TJ Watt has more than done his part to help the Steelers win. He’s a legendary Steeler but much like the second half of Ben’s career, Watt been hamstrung by by an overrated coach and playing for an organization that every year has major holes springing leaks somewhere. Towards the end of Ben’s career, the o-line and secondary were a joke (especially at corner.) Since Ben left, the Steelers have obviously had major issues at QB, WR and inside linebacker after Shazier’s devastating injury:

Watt has been great and has given his all, just like Ben (who never bitched even when he wasn’t allowed to audible!) TJ conducted himself like a pro every game, no matter what.

You try to help your team and a longtime cornerstone player if you’re looking to move on. No reason to fuck a guy like Watt over. He’s been a pleasure to watch from day one.

What are you looking for? Direct conflict? No one expects Watt to hammer Tomlin outright. Ben didn’t. But everyone knew when he was unhappy and why. Ben is also a 2x Super Bowl Champion. His legacy is secured, and with his personal history he was certainly smart enough to keep his mouth shut when it came to criticizing everyone’s sacred cow. I have a feeling that once he’s in the HOF, Ben will open up more and we’ll find out what he really thinks of Mediocre Mike.

TJ has publicly stated that Tomlin is “his coach” and he wouldn’t want to play for any one else. You don’t have to praise the guy like that if you think he’s a problem. Watt loves his coach because he has built up some phenomenal stats under Tomlin and gets to do what he wants. Not a bad deal. But he’s not a winner. Neither is Heyward. Two “cornerstones” of this team and they absolutely vanish in the playoffs. TJ measures his success by his contract, his stats and his DPOY hardware. I’d rather have a player with hardware on his finger, something TJ will never have.

The Steelers don’t owe him a damn thing. He’s won exactly zero playoff games, and he’s basically disappeared in the postseason. If anything, he has helped perpetuate NHALS, one of the most embarrassing “achievements” ever. Yay mediocrity! Sorry, there is no sentimentality here. Watt wants $40+ million? Why? So he can have the biggest contract... I guess when you can’t win a ring, what else do you have left? His “legend” will be build on being the highest paid defender (until the next guy signs, anyway). Oh, and tackling Derrick Henry 10 times in a row when he didn’t have the football.

Franco did more for this franchise than TJ could ever dream and they let him go to Seattle. TJ isn’t worth more than Franco in Steeler lore. Hell, Watt won’t be remembered as fondly as James Harrison. Harrison was a winner. He will be remembered as the better Steeler and the guy you’d want on your team. Watt will be remembered as the Ralph Kiner of the Steelers.

If they trade him, they are idiots if they take a lower offer so he can land on a contender. If that works out, fine. If I am GM, I wouldn’t screw him just to spite him. But I also would not do him any favors. Once he turns down the best and final offer, I am looking out for the team. My concern for TJ Watt and his “legacy” ends when he says “no”.

[Steeldrama]

Franchise Icons Franco and Rod Woodson were not traded.
Contracts were up.
The Steelers deemed them past their prime and allowed them to move on (Franco wisely/Woodson not so wisely).

The Steelers' organization surely views Watt as an all-time Steelers' great (I don't think fans feel quite the same given the lack of playoff success).
Difference here is Watt is still under contract.
I too want him traded as opposed to a historic contract.
Franchise tag still an option, but then the Steelers are falling into the dreaded hostage vs. Volunteers scenario.

How often historically have the Steelers traded away disgruntled stars?

AB was/is batshit crazy so he had to go.

The Mike Merriweather situation kinda comes to mind.
He sat out the 1988 season in a contract dispute before being traded to the Vikings for a 1st rd pick (Tom Ricketts. UGH. ONE LOUSY PICK AWAY FROM BAD MOON RISON!).

Watt doesn't strike me as the type to sit out the year, but the Steelers in theory don't have to do shit right now since Watt under contract and the franchise tag an option (doesn't seem likely).

If it's me I'm on the horn with all the contenders.

Green Bay won't do it because they don't pay big money for players in their 30's.

You know who isn't being talked about?

Buffalo.

Time for that team to shit or get off the pot.

For my old college girlfriend Buffalo Jill, I'm rooting for the Bills to finally climb that Super Bowl mountain.

The Bills not so long ago threw a wad at an expired Von Miller.

Watt WAY better at this stage of their careers than that clown.

Yes the Bills brought in Bosa, but that dude's beyond FRA-GEEE-LAY

Ahhh fuck it.

Watt's not going anywhere.

You know it.

And I know it.

Just passing some time before my ride to golf shows up.

Happy 4th fellas.

Keep the ball (and cart) in the fairway

[K_C_]

Nah. This is business. You take the best deal, regardless of where it sends Watt.

He has no problem holding out on the Steelers. I have no problem trading him to Carolina, GB, or anywhere in the league.

I take the best deal with the team that is looking like it will finish with the fewest wins. All ties go to the garbage franchise. If it fucks him over in the process, so be it.

Watt is one of the biggest problems on this team. He won’t say a bad word about his beloved Coach. If he had a strong desire to win, he would have opened his mouth years ago. He wants his money and his stats. That’s what he cares about. Winning is at least 3rd on his priority list, and I’d bet it’s even lower than that.

We have Corporate Cam the Company Man and Corporate Watt the Company Twat.

That’s just not how this works.

Ben Roethlisberger was a 2 time Super Bowl champion and take all the time you need to show me specific quotes of Ben being critical of Mikey T. You know, while Ben was still playing for the Steelers.

Again take all the time you need.

TJ Watt has more than done his part to help the Steelers win. He’s a legendary Steeler but much like the second half of Ben’s career, Watt been hamstrung by by an overrated coach and playing for an organization that every year has major holes springing leaks somewhere. Towards the end of Ben’s career, the o-line and secondary were a joke (especially at corner.) Since Ben left, the Steelers have obviously had major issues at QB, WR and inside linebacker after Shazier’s devastating injury:

Watt has been great and has given his all, just like Ben (who never bitched even when he wasn’t allowed to audible!) TJ conducted himself like a pro every game, no matter what.

You try to help your team and a longtime cornerstone player if you’re looking to move on. No reason to fuck a guy like Watt over. He’s been a pleasure to watch from day one.

What are you looking for? Direct conflict? No one expects Watt to hammer Tomlin outright. Ben didn’t. But everyone knew when he was unhappy and why. Ben is also a 2x Super Bowl Champion. His legacy is secured, and with his personal history he was certainly smart enough to keep his mouth shut when it came to criticizing everyone’s sacred cow. I have a feeling that once he’s in the HOF, Ben will open up more and we’ll find out what he really thinks of Mediocre Mike.

TJ has publicly stated that Tomlin is “his coach” and he wouldn’t want to play for any one else. You don’t have to praise the guy like that if you think he’s a problem. Watt loves his coach because he has built up some phenomenal stats under Tomlin and gets to do what he wants. Not a bad deal. But he’s not a winner. Neither is Heyward. Two “cornerstones” of this team and they absolutely vanish in the playoffs. TJ measures his success by his contract, his stats and his DPOY hardware. I’d rather have a player with hardware on his finger, something TJ will never have.

The Steelers don’t owe him a damn thing. He’s won exactly zero playoff games, and he’s basically disappeared in the postseason. If anything, he has helped perpetuate NHALS, one of the most embarrassing “achievements” ever. Yay mediocrity! Sorry, there is no sentimentality here. Watt wants $40+ million? Why? So he can have the biggest contract... I guess when you can’t win a ring, what else do you have left? His “legend” will be build on being the highest paid defender (until the next guy signs, anyway). Oh, and tackling Derrick Henry 10 times in a row when he didn’t have the football.

Franco did more for this franchise than TJ could ever dream and they let him go to Seattle. TJ isn’t worth more than Franco in Steeler lore. Hell, Watt won’t be remembered as fondly as James Harrison. Harrison was a winner. He will be remembered as the better Steeler and the guy you’d want on your team. Watt will be remembered as the Ralph Kiner of the Steelers.

If they trade him, they are idiots if they take a lower offer so he can land on a contender. If that works out, fine. If I am GM, I wouldn’t screw him just to spite him. But I also would not do him any favors. Once he turns down the best and final offer, I am looking out for the team. My concern for TJ Watt and his “legacy” ends when he says “no”.

Your first paragraph says it all. Ben never said anything critical of Tomlin....until after he was out of the game. He was often passive aggressive of some OC's but Ben always stayed away from Cool Shades when it came to criticizing him. Why? Ben wanted to play his entire career in Pittsburgh and so does Watt. Leaving would give Watt a better shot at a ring, but I'm sure TJ would much rather stay in his adopted home town. That doesn't make him any less of a great player. Ask Dan Marino who was a first ballot Hall of Famer, just like Watt will be.

My only point with Watt is that, if at all possible, you send Watt to a contender. Why? He deserves it. Great player. Great person. Represented the Steelers as well as you're going to see a great player. Sure, Watt wants huge money and he's worth it, no matter where he ends up. You'd want one last huge contract too if you were in his situation. As for the playoff thing, Watt outscored Ben at the half of the Chiefs game and the defense fought its ass off in that game with absolutely no help from the offense. Did they underperform as a unit in other playoff games? Absolutely. Does that make Watt any less great? Nope.

Like I said in my last post, the Steelers under Tomlin always have huge holes in huge areas and it costs them when it mattered. Last year Russell Wilson played well (so did Fields) but they had only 1 WR to throw to and for defenses to worry about. Dan Moore and Broderick Jones might have been one of the single worst sets of tackles I have ever seen play professional football. This year that unit might actually be worse. Last season the defense and everyone involved got trampled by Derrick Henry. Did Watt fall off the last 5 games? Yes. So did Highsmith and Herbig who did absolutely nothing in those final games. I would most definitely trade Watt if the price was right but unlike you, I don't see him at all as some choker...and I'd guarantee you that past Steelers like James Harrison and Ben would think you were an idiot for thinking that too.

[CoolShades]

That’s just not how this works.

Ben Roethlisberger was a 2 time Super Bowl champion and take all the time you need to show me specific quotes of Ben being critical of Mikey T. You know, while Ben was still playing for the Steelers.

Again take all the time you need.

TJ Watt has more than done his part to help the Steelers win. He’s a legendary Steeler but much like the second half of Ben’s career, Watt been hamstrung by by an overrated coach and playing for an organization that every year has major holes springing leaks somewhere. Towards the end of Ben’s career, the o-line and secondary were a joke (especially at corner.) Since Ben left, the Steelers have obviously had major issues at QB, WR and inside linebacker after Shazier’s devastating injury:

Watt has been great and has given his all, just like Ben (who never bitched even when he wasn’t allowed to audible!) TJ conducted himself like a pro every game, no matter what.

You try to help your team and a longtime cornerstone player if you’re looking to move on. No reason to fuck a guy like Watt over. He’s been a pleasure to watch from day one.

What are you looking for? Direct conflict? No one expects Watt to hammer Tomlin outright. Ben didn’t. But everyone knew when he was unhappy and why. Ben is also a 2x Super Bowl Champion. His legacy is secured, and with his personal history he was certainly smart enough to keep his mouth shut when it came to criticizing everyone’s sacred cow. I have a feeling that once he’s in the HOF, Ben will open up more and we’ll find out what he really thinks of Mediocre Mike.

TJ has publicly stated that Tomlin is “his coach” and he wouldn’t want to play for any one else. You don’t have to praise the guy like that if you think he’s a problem. Watt loves his coach because he has built up some phenomenal stats under Tomlin and gets to do what he wants. Not a bad deal. But he’s not a winner. Neither is Heyward. Two “cornerstones” of this team and they absolutely vanish in the playoffs. TJ measures his success by his contract, his stats and his DPOY hardware. I’d rather have a player with hardware on his finger, something TJ will never have.

The Steelers don’t owe him a damn thing. He’s won exactly zero playoff games, and he’s basically disappeared in the postseason. If anything, he has helped perpetuate NHALS, one of the most embarrassing “achievements” ever. Yay mediocrity! Sorry, there is no sentimentality here. Watt wants $40+ million? Why? So he can have the biggest contract... I guess when you can’t win a ring, what else do you have left? His “legend” will be build on being the highest paid defender (until the next guy signs, anyway). Oh, and tackling Derrick Henry 10 times in a row when he didn’t have the football.

Franco did more for this franchise than TJ could ever dream and they let him go to Seattle. TJ isn’t worth more than Franco in Steeler lore. Hell, Watt won’t be remembered as fondly as James Harrison. Harrison was a winner. He will be remembered as the better Steeler and the guy you’d want on your team. Watt will be remembered as the Ralph Kiner of the Steelers.

If they trade him, they are idiots if they take a lower offer so he can land on a contender. If that works out, fine. If I am GM, I wouldn’t screw him just to spite him. But I also would not do him any favors. Once he turns down the best and final offer, I am looking out for the team. My concern for TJ Watt and his “legacy” ends when he says “no”.

Your first paragraph says it all. Ben never said anything critical of Tomlin....until after he was out of the game. He was often passive aggressive of some OC's but Ben always stayed away from Cool Shades when it came to criticizing him. Why? Ben wanted to play his entire career in Pittsburgh and so does Watt. Leaving would give Watt a better shot at a ring, but I'm sure TJ would much rather stay in his adopted home town. That doesn't make him any less of a great player. Ask Dan Marino who was a first ballot Hall of Famer, just like Watt will be.

My only point with Watt is that, if at all possible, you send Watt to a contender. Why? He deserves it. Great player. Great person. Represented the Steelers as well as you're going to see a great player. Sure, Watt wants huge money and he's worth it, no matter where he ends up. You'd want one last huge contract too if you were in his situation. As for the playoff thing, Watt outscored Ben at the half of the Chiefs game and the defense fought its ass off in that game with absolutely no help from the offense. Did they underperform as a unit in other playoff games? Absolutely. Does that make Watt any less great? Nope.

Like I said in my last post, the Steelers under Tomlin always have huge holes in huge areas and it costs them when it mattered. Last year Russell Wilson played well (so did Fields) but they had only 1 WR to throw to and for defenses to worry about. Dan Moore and Broderick Jones might have been one of the single worst sets of tackles I have ever seen play professional football. This year that unit might actually be worse. Last season the defense and everyone involved got trampled by Derrick Henry. Did Watt fall off the last 5 games? Yes. So did Highsmith and Herbig who did absolutely nothing in those final games. I would most definitely trade Watt if the price was right but unlike you, I don't see him at all as some choker...and I'd guarantee you that past Steelers like James Harrison and Ben would think you were an idiot for thinking that too.

You can’t guarantee shit. I realize you are the biggest “expert” on this board, but you don’t know these people. I could “guarantee” you that past Steelers like Ben and Harrison would think you are an idiot for thinking TJ is anything more than a regular season stat gobbler, but that doesn’t make it so. I understand you don’t see him as a choker and that’s fine. However, you can’t bolster your opinion with imagined opinions of players you don’t know.

TJ deserves it? Why? You don’t know if he’s a great person or an asshole. You know what the media tells you and what you believe. Maybe he’s publicly great, but an asshole and egomaniac/narcissist in the locker room. Maybe he’s a wonderful guy on and off the field. I don’t know him so I don’t know. Has he ever taken less money, or a team friendly deal so the Steelers could field a better team? I haven’t seen that. You know who has? Sidney Crosby, and he makes a TON less than Watt. Crosby has also won 3 cups. Is Watt’s life/family going to suffer if he took say, $38 million vs. $41 million? No. But it would seem that all his camp is pushing right now is that he wants more than Garrett in some paycheck dick measuring contest. Ben didn’t hold out for every last dime either, because he knew that being a one-helmet guy would be worth a lot once his career ended. If Watt can’t see that, that’s fine. It’s his life and his career, but I am not going to shed any tears for the guy if he leaves because of a contract dispute. He will get a legitimate offer... it will be up to him to take it or not. My guess is the Steelers will overpay him, but IMO it will be a mistake. TJ Kiner will do nothing but help secure NHALS, which is hardly worth $40+ MM/per. Not to me, anyway.

You think Watt would sign a contract that is incentive based? How about he signs something that would make him the highest paid defensive player in the league, but only if he gets to a Super Bowl? Nah. He won’t do that.

I’m not questioning his effort or his personality. I’m questioning his impact on the field. He should dominate the game like Lawrence Taylor if he wants to be the highest paid defensive player, especially in the postseason. Go look at his playoff stats. They are terrible. If he can be schemed out of EVERY playoff game where he makes zero impact, what good is that? He’s 0 for 4. 4 games, one sack. Outside of his scoop and score against KC, he’s done bupkis. That highest paid defense has been a playoff paper tiger, and he’s the most prominent member.

The Steelers have paid him for his services, and they’ve paid him well. They owe him nothing more. Trading him to a contender is not necessary or required. Getting the best trade value is. If he’s not willing to give a hometown discount, why should the Steelers feel obligated to do something for him that won’t maximize the benefit to the franchise?

Only an idiot would think being sentimental is smart business IF the goal is to win championships. If the goal is to only be competitive, achieve NHALS, and keep fan-favorite players happy no matter what, well that’s different. And that’s todays Steelers.

[K_C_]

What are you looking for? Direct conflict? No one expects Watt to hammer Tomlin outright. Ben didn’t. But everyone knew when he was unhappy and why. Ben is also a 2x Super Bowl Champion. His legacy is secured, and with his personal history he was certainly smart enough to keep his mouth shut when it came to criticizing everyone’s sacred cow. I have a feeling that once he’s in the HOF, Ben will open up more and we’ll find out what he really thinks of Mediocre Mike.

TJ has publicly stated that Tomlin is “his coach” and he wouldn’t want to play for any one else. You don’t have to praise the guy like that if you think he’s a problem. Watt loves his coach because he has built up some phenomenal stats under Tomlin and gets to do what he wants. Not a bad deal. But he’s not a winner. Neither is Heyward. Two “cornerstones” of this team and they absolutely vanish in the playoffs. TJ measures his success by his contract, his stats and his DPOY hardware. I’d rather have a player with hardware on his finger, something TJ will never have.

The Steelers don’t owe him a damn thing. He’s won exactly zero playoff games, and he’s basically disappeared in the postseason. If anything, he has helped perpetuate NHALS, one of the most embarrassing “achievements” ever. Yay mediocrity! Sorry, there is no sentimentality here. Watt wants $40+ million? Why? So he can have the biggest contract... I guess when you can’t win a ring, what else do you have left? His “legend” will be build on being the highest paid defender (until the next guy signs, anyway). Oh, and tackling Derrick Henry 10 times in a row when he didn’t have the football.

Franco did more for this franchise than TJ could ever dream and they let him go to Seattle. TJ isn’t worth more than Franco in Steeler lore. Hell, Watt won’t be remembered as fondly as James Harrison. Harrison was a winner. He will be remembered as the better Steeler and the guy you’d want on your team. Watt will be remembered as the Ralph Kiner of the Steelers.

If they trade him, they are idiots if they take a lower offer so he can land on a contender. If that works out, fine. If I am GM, I wouldn’t screw him just to spite him. But I also would not do him any favors. Once he turns down the best and final offer, I am looking out for the team. My concern for TJ Watt and his “legacy” ends when he says “no”.

Your first paragraph says it all. Ben never said anything critical of Tomlin....until after he was out of the game. He was often passive aggressive of some OC's but Ben always stayed away from Cool Shades when it came to criticizing him. Why? Ben wanted to play his entire career in Pittsburgh and so does Watt. Leaving would give Watt a better shot at a ring, but I'm sure TJ would much rather stay in his adopted home town. That doesn't make him any less of a great player. Ask Dan Marino who was a first ballot Hall of Famer, just like Watt will be.

My only point with Watt is that, if at all possible, you send Watt to a contender. Why? He deserves it. Great player. Great person. Represented the Steelers as well as you're going to see a great player. Sure, Watt wants huge money and he's worth it, no matter where he ends up. You'd want one last huge contract too if you were in his situation. As for the playoff thing, Watt outscored Ben at the half of the Chiefs game and the defense fought its ass off in that game with absolutely no help from the offense. Did they underperform as a unit in other playoff games? Absolutely. Does that make Watt any less great? Nope.

Like I said in my last post, the Steelers under Tomlin always have huge holes in huge areas and it costs them when it mattered. Last year Russell Wilson played well (so did Fields) but they had only 1 WR to throw to and for defenses to worry about. Dan Moore and Broderick Jones might have been one of the single worst sets of tackles I have ever seen play professional football. This year that unit might actually be worse. Last season the defense and everyone involved got trampled by Derrick Henry. Did Watt fall off the last 5 games? Yes. So did Highsmith and Herbig who did absolutely nothing in those final games. I would most definitely trade Watt if the price was right but unlike you, I don't see him at all as some choker...and I'd guarantee you that past Steelers like James Harrison and Ben would think you were an idiot for thinking that too.

You can’t guarantee shit. I realize you are the biggest “expert” on this board, but you don’t know these people. I could “guarantee” you that past Steelers like Ben and Harrison would think you are an idiot for thinking TJ is anything more than a regular season stat gobbler, but that doesn’t make it so. I understand you don’t see him as a choker and that’s fine. However, you can’t bolster your opinion with imagined opinions of players you don’t know.

TJ deserves it? Why? You don’t know if he’s a great person or an asshole. You know what the media tells you and what you believe. Maybe he’s publicly great, but an asshole and egomaniac/narcissist in the locker room. Maybe he’s a wonderful guy on and off the field. I don’t know him so I don’t know. Has he ever taken less money, or a team friendly deal so the Steelers could field a better team? I haven’t seen that. You know who has? Sidney Crosby, and he makes a TON less than Watt. Crosby has also won 3 cups. Is Watt’s life/family going to suffer if he took say, $38 million vs. $41 million? No. But it would seem that all his camp is pushing right now is that he wants more than Garrett in some paycheck dick measuring contest. Ben didn’t hold out for every last dime either, because he knew that being a one-helmet guy would be worth a lot once his career ended. If Watt can’t see that, that’s fine. It’s his life and his career, but I am not going to shed any tears for the guy if he leaves because of a contract dispute. He will get a legitimate offer... it will be up to him to take it or not. My guess is the Steelers will overpay him, but IMO it will be a mistake. TJ Kiner will do nothing but help secure NHALS, which is hardly worth $40+ MM/per. Not to me, anyway.

You think Watt would sign a contract that is incentive based? How about he signs something that would make him the highest paid defensive player in the league, but only if he gets to a Super Bowl? Nah. He won’t do that.

I’m not questioning his effort or his personality. I’m questioning his impact on the field. He should dominate the game like Lawrence Taylor if he wants to be the highest paid defensive player, especially in the postseason. Go look at his playoff stats. They are terrible. If he can be schemed out of EVERY playoff game where he makes zero impact, what good is that? He’s 0 for 4. 4 games, one sack. Outside of his scoop and score against KC, he’s done bupkis. That highest paid defense has been a playoff paper tiger, and he’s the most prominent member.

The Steelers have paid him for his services, and they’ve paid him well. They owe him nothing more. Trading him to a contender is not necessary or required. Getting the best trade value is. If he’s not willing to give a hometown discount, why should the Steelers feel obligated to do something for him that won’t maximize the benefit to the franchise?

Only an idiot would think being sentimental is smart business IF the goal is to win championships. If the goal is to only be competitive, achieve NHALS, and keep fan-favorite players happy no matter what, well that’s different. And that’s todays Steelers.

Oh I can guarantee guys that have been out there on the field playing at an incredible level would laugh at you for saying TJ Watt is a choker. No question in my mind about that. I've heard people say Ben "choked" in his first Super Bowl but I disagree. He was a young guy playing in the biggest game of his lifetime. Biggest game anybody can play in and while he struggled mightily for sure, Ben also scored when Bettis couldn't score on 3 shots from inside the 1. Later couldn't get a first down to seal the game. Ben made a few plays to help the Steelers win but he most definitely wasn't anywhere near the biggest reason the Steelers won. Football is a team effort and Watt gets a shit ton of attention. He often has to beat double teams then still has a RB to deal with. As I said before, I'm much, much more concerned about how Highsmith shows up big 3 or 4 times per year and the rest he's invisible. Herbig, to me, took a big step back last year. I'm waaaaaaay more concerned about those guys than I am Watt. You likely won't see a pass rusher again as good as Watt in your lifetime, whether you like it or not. That's how great he's been.

Watt IS going to get a huge deal, because he's worth it. That deal will probably come from the Steelers, but if it doesn't, TJ will sign a huge deal with a contender because teams looking to try and win a Lombardi know Watt, with a coach that actually knows what he's doing, could help that team win a Super Bowl.

Tomlin lucked out having so many of Cowher's players and won a Super Bowl not long after Cowher retired. That isn't a coincidence and no matter how great Ben was, the Steelers rarely were serious contenders for a Lombardi the second half of Ben's career. That's because of Mike Tomlin. Until he's gone, nothing is really going to change so sure, I'd love to see Watt moved to a team where he might able to hoist a Lombardi. Dude deserves it.

One of the greatest Steelers defensive players of all time.

[anpsteel]

I’m leaning toward trading Watt for the best they can get, because I want no part of paying a declining player $40M p/y

That being said, a large part of Watts lack of playoff production comes from Tomlins determination to have him line up on a spot and “do his assignment”

We saw countless times last year. against the Ravens in the playoffs, Watt crashing down and ignoring the ball carrier.

They were basic read options, where the qb is reading the edge


The ravens abused that bad

[955876]

The ravens abused that bad

Which is why Jibbs wears aviators. His options are looking cool or putting that blank, clueless stare on tape.

He opts to look cool. His boss, the media, and legions of idiot fans believe it.

Watt looked like a fool in that playoff game. As did Capt. Cam.

[anpsteel]

The ravens abused that bad

Which is why Jibbs wears aviators. His options are looking cool or putting that blank, clueless stare on tape.

He opts to look cool. His boss, the media, and legions of idiot fans believe it.

Watt looked like a fool in that playoff game. As did Capt. Cam.

Watt does what he’s told.

Unlike minkah who blew up on the sideline last year because the coverage they were calling was fucking dumb - and seemingly he changed the call - which iirc, worked - and now he’s gone

Anyway, this is all a symptom of the Tomlin disease that results in the team being dog walked in the playoffs.

Tomlin runs the exact same shit, with almost no deviation

Every opponent knows what’s coming

[955876]

Oh I agree. But Watt has also said he doesn’t like moving around.

And like the awesome “players coach” that he is Jibba Jabber obliges.

[Gonzo]

The ravens abused that bad

Which is why Jibbs wears aviators. His options are looking cool or putting that blank, clueless stare on tape.

He opts to look cool. His boss, the media, and legions of idiot fans believe it.

Watt looked like a fool in that playoff game. As did Capt. Cam.

Anyway, this is all a symptom of the Tomlin disease that results in the team being dog walked in the playoffs.

Tomlin runs the exact same shit, whit almost no deviation

Every opponent knows what’s coming

This is the core problem and nothing else really matters
Until he leaves or is forced to hire real coordinators and relinquish all game control and draft control … nothing matters
It is why so many hope for distaster …. Not spite or not being a true fan but because it appears to be only way he leaves and things can change
Tomlin is running a racket …. Follow his rules and shut your mouth and we run an easy scheme get NHALS and we all get paid. He drafts, develops and coaches to that scheme

[Thrillsseeker]

The ravens abused that bad

Which is why Jibbs wears aviators. His options are looking cool or putting that blank, clueless stare on tape.

He opts to look cool. His boss, the media, and legions of idiot fans believe it.

Watt looked like a fool in that playoff game. As did Capt. Cam.

Watt does what he’s told.

Unlike minkah who blew up on the sideline last year because the coverage they were calling was fucking dumb - and seemingly he changed the call - which iirc, workrd - and now he’s gone

Anyway, this is all a symptom of the Tomlin disease that results in the team being dog walked in the playoffs.

Tomlin runs the exact same shit, whit almost no deviation

Every opponent knows what’s coming

How more people don’t highlight this ineptitude to massive proportions is beyond me. He’s a Fraud and my hope is his name is tarnished for eternity as reg season NHALS champ. Or Chump.

[steelmann58]

Sorry but you can’t give him 40 million for a 31 year old who has injuries issues. This really worries me if the give him a long term deal.

[CoolShades]

Oh I can guarantee guys that have been out there on the field playing at an incredible level would laugh at you for saying TJ Watt is a choker. No question in my mind about that.

And there it is.

We know. Everything is in your mind. In your world, if you think it, it’s not your personal opinion... it’s a fact. Why would you ever question it?

I never once used the word “choker”. Well done.

One of the greatest Steelers defensive players of all time.

To never win a single playoff game.

Yep. That’s worth $40+ million for the next 4 seasons. It’s not like his body isn’t breaking down or he’s injury prone or anything. He makes you happy and he deserves it.

Don’t worry, KC. I’m sure the Steelers will sign him to a big, fat, guaranteed contract. After all, NHALS is in play, and we all know how bad Mediocre Mike’s regular season record is without Watt. TJ has this mediocre franchise by the balls.

Watt does what he’s told.

Unlike minkah who blew up on the sideline last year because the coverage they were calling was fucking dumb - and seemingly he changed the call - which iirc, workrd - and now he’s gone

Anyway, this is all a symptom of the Tomlin disease that results in the team being dog walked in the playoffs.

Tomlin runs the exact same shit, whit almost no deviation

Every opponent knows what’s coming

This seems to be a theme. I recall in the Las Vegas game, where Pickett hit CAIII on that long TD pass, it was an audible, and the coaches were pissed. I remember Tomlin saying something about that play that made me think that Pickett was going to get his ass chewed. That TD only took 10 seconds off the clock, and we all know that Tomlin would rather grind 3 minutes off the clock than score a TD. Hell, the offense wasn’t even at the 50 yard line, and Pickett saw something, audibled and threw it between the numbers? And it worked? Can’t have that! 70 yards on one play is NOT acceptable, especially when Jibbs is questioned!

If someone like Watt can’t deviate from or question what Tomlin demands (tackle Henry on every play no matter what, even if he doesn’t have the ball and you look like an idiot), what chance does anyone else have?

Anyone who speaks out or bucks the system is banished. Do what you are told, help achieve NHALS, and you have a job for life. (If you play your cards right, you can even get your less talented brother a nice contract and a few million dollars.)

I didn’t know that Minkah blew up on the sidelines. Good for him if he did.

This franchise is a joke.

[Thrillsseeker]

^^^yup. Minkah basically called out the DC about his ridiculous coverage and he called what Minkah said to call. This org with its inept coaching is a disgrace.

All yes men to go along with the Fraud and what the org wants. Pathetic.

[K_C_]

Oh I can guarantee guys that have been out there on the field playing at an incredible level would laugh at you for saying TJ Watt is a choker. No question in my mind about that.

And there it is.

We know. Everything is in your mind. In your world, if you think it, it’s not your personal opinion... it’s a fact. Why would you ever question it?

I never once used the word “choker”. Well done

Oh please.



You believe Watt is a postseason choker in the same exact way I believe Bettis is a postseason choker.

TJ never had a Bill Buckner moment like Bettis and he does have probably just as many TD's as Bettis does in the postseason ( ) but your entire spiel is about Watt not showing up in the postseason and you're entitled to that take.

I've been saying that no matter how great Watt is (and make no mistake, Watt is great) I would 100% trade him right now to the highest bidder, if I were Omar Khan.

Overall, what you don't get is that we're on the same page but If Watt does get a big new contract from the Steelers, I'm not going to cry like a little girl about it. Great player and a whole lot of fun to watch.

Taking the Steelers under Tomlin overly serious is silly. They aren't going to win shit with or without Watt unless Khan gets lucky next April and finds the next Ben Roethlisberger or Terry Bradshaw. Tomlin has to have a generational talent at QB to win big.

It's really that simple.

[cop1211]

Trade Watt and 5th rounder to Washington for their 1st, 3rd, and WR McClaughlin.